# Why CAN'T I use this bedding?



## Frizzle

So at the local Fleet Farm (hardware store), I came across this large bags of aspen, twice the size of the petco stuff, and half the price. I'd really like to buy them for the mice, but there was a big warning about not using it for small animals, specifying gerbils, hamsters, mice, rats, and a bunch of other stuff. Any thoughts as to why? Here is a link to their product page: http://www.americanexcelsior.com/woodfibers/applications/bedding/horse.php

They do market aspen for small rodents, here: http://www.americanexcelsior.com/woodfibers/applications/bedding/aspen.php I just wonder if they put a different package on it, bump up the price, and say it's fine... I think I'm going to email them about why I can't use the horse aspen, although I really don't expect a straight answer.

Edit: They didn't actually have the pet stuff in the store, otherwise I prolly would have bought that. And I didn't get the horse stuff, I figured it best to find out the why's beforehand.


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## thewesterngate

I really don't see why it'd be an issue except for dust. But if it's screened as well as they say, dust would be a non-issue?


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## besty74

looks like they are just trying to bump up the price, it will be interesting to hear what reason they give you.


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## Frizzle

It's soooo much aspen... I'm really hoping its just corporate greed on their end, I sent them a quick email so here's to hoping that I'll hear back in the next 24 hrs!


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## morning-star

thewesterngate said:


> I really don't see why it'd be an issue except for dust. But if it's screened as well as they say, dust would be a non-issue?


horse stuff should be less dusty, as it can mess up the horses lungs....

its fine they are just trying to make more money.


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## Rhasputin

They put warnings like that on all the horse bedding, pine, aspen, paper, you name it. I don't know why, it's all the same stuff you get from the pet store, maybe they're just trying to cover their butts, and be on the safe side.

But tons of people use horse pine and horse aspen, and it's the same exact stuff as the stuff in the pet store.


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## MojoMouse

It's very annoying that so many products for small animal pets are bumped up in price by pet stores. It happens with food products, medication and accessories as well.

In business, the pet market is considered to be "irrational", meaning that people will pay excessive prices for anything to do with their pets. Manufacturers, suppliers and retailers love it because it's a recession proof industry.


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## Jack Garcia

It also happens with human products. Disposable razors are a good example. Women will pay more for the same product (just a different color) than men, so you'll sometimes find 10 pink razors for $7 and 10 blue razors for $2.99, manufactured by the same company using the same material, and sold in the same store. The only difference is the way it's marketed.

That's what seems like is happening here: the bedding is the same, but the marketers know that small animal people will pay more (because they generally use less) than horse fanciers. It's a very common and successful marketing tactic.


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## MojoMouse

You're right about the pink razors! :lol:

Branding and how things are marketed is such a huge industry. So many ripoffs mad possible because people will pay a premium for something that makes them feel better about themselves and their purchase, on top of the value of the actual purchase itself. It's understandable with products with an actual quality difference, but bizarre when it's for an identical product that's simply packaged differently.


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## Jack Garcia

It's true for all kinds of human products: women (who do most of the shopping in Western countries) will generally pay more than men will, for what ever reason.

And I'm sure some researcher somewhere has determined that small animal people will by and large pay more than horse fanciers will for the same products (bedding, hay, food).

It's perfectly legitimate to use men's razors (or shaving cream and antiperspirants, which are also often cheaper but identical).


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## MojoMouse

Jack Garcia said:


> It's true for all kinds of human products: women (who do most of the shopping in Western countries) will generally pay more than men will, for what ever reason.


I hate the fact that you're quite right about that! It's widely recognised and documented. 



> It's perfectly legitimate to use men's razors (or shaving cream and antiperspirants, which are also often cheaper but identical).


Men's antiperspirants have a different smell. I'd stick to the female version in this case. I always buy men's razors though, even though the colour is a serious affront to my femininity.


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## tinyhartmouseries

Haha, I'm a lilac spring, not a thunder musk.


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## MojoMouse

tinyhartmouseries said:


> Haha, I'm a lilac spring, not a thunder musk.


:lol:


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## Jack Garcia

What was that one slogan, "Made for a woman, strong enough for a man?"

I always thought they were describing me...


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## moustress

I've been using the humongous plain brown wrapped bale for horses. It's aspen, and it seems to work well enough. I actually think it may control odor better as it's more shredded than shaved. Mills Fleet Farm also has Kaytee Aspen for much less than the pet mega stores do, but the horse bale is an incredible deal, and my meeces seem to be doing fine on it.


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## MojoMouse

Jack Garcia said:


> What was that one slogan, "Made for a woman, strong enough for a man?"
> 
> I always thought they were describing me...


:lol:

You're just a little flower at heart, I'm sure.


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## MojoMouse

moustress said:


> I've been using the humongous plain brown wrapped bale for horses. It's aspen, and it seems to work well enough. I actually think it may control odor better as it's more shredded than shaved. Mills Fleet Farm also has Kaytee Aspen for much less than the pet mega stores do, but the horse bale is an incredible deal, and my meeces seem to be doing fine on it.


That sounds like a great deal - and I'm sure the pet supplies people hate it when consumers purchase bulk from farm supplies rather than their petshops! Things like substrate for mouseries can get very expensive unless people are aware of the better value options.


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## icedmice

I agree with the statements above. Pet shops are generally overpriced.

Aspen is quite dear here, I have seen it marketed for reptiles too. Looks fine as a bedding, if you found it in bigger bags and for cheaper I'd grab it!
The dearer bedding is fine if you only keep a couple mice, but for a whole herd of them looking into more affordable options is the way to go. Keeping them clean is the priority.

My brother works as a wood machinist, I asked what happens to the sawdust and shavings in the warehouse. A man collects it to market as pet bedding. My brother told me some of that is treated pine and he wouldn't reccomend it anyway. It's all mixed timber, whatever they're machining, a lot of it is supplies for renovation companies. You know, I never thought of where the shavings came from before he went into that industry.
Makes you wonder what brand it's being marketed as  . You got to watch out there are so many dodgy dealers.

I cross cut shred old newspapers, it's cheaper but so much more time consuming! It's just the daily and local rag.


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## Cordane

icedmice said:


> I cross cut shred old newspapers, it's cheaper but so much more time consuming! It's just the daily and local rag.


I use to do that as well since we kept every news paper since we moved, (its been 6 years) but I actually ran out of newspaper. 6 years of newspapers being used as bedding and for lighting fires.. it doesn't last long. Thats probably because I live in the country and we get maybe 3 a week. Dad has resorted to getting the papers from work and bringing them home.


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## MojoMouse

I found that shredded newspaper isn't absorbent enough, so I still use paper based litter, and hay. I buy hay from a petshop - the price is unbelievably expensive for a tiny amount! But, supply and demand - being in an inner city location I have to travel a LONG way to get bulk hay, so the petshops are simply charging for the convenience. People like me pay. Tch.


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## Cordane

And this is why I'm glad I have cows. We buy 300 bails for 16 cows (including the yearly calves) and that lasts use through til and after we pick up next years hay. ($6 for a large bail, picked up from the neighbors just over the fence)


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## Frizzle

Just wanted to update with a reply from the company. It was basically copy and pasted from the site, and the guy carbon copied it to several other people. Prolly to make sure he handled my question professionally, and that no trade secretes were exposed. :lol:

"Thanks for your below email. We developed Premium Horse Bedding specifically for use as a premium equine bedding product. We include a warning label on each bag which reads as follows: Do not use for bedding of small and infant animals such as gerbils, mink, hamsters, guinea pigs, mice and rats. Premium Horse Bedding may cause respiratory problems in these small animals, including death.

We do have another product which we call Aspen Bed which is specifically for use as contact bedding for small animals. We have manufactured this product for decades at our plant in Rice Lake, WI. It is a premier bedding product for small animals for many reasons. It is very soft and it actually encourages nesting as many small animals like to burrow and nest. It is an all natural aspen fiber product and is virtually odorless, contains minimal dust, is highly absorbent, and is non allergenic. Aspen Bed helps to provide small animals with a healthier environment. You can see and read about this product on our corporate web site at www.americanexcelsior.com. Also, if you would forward your mailing address to me, I'd be glad to send you our product literature sheet as well as our Material Specification and MSDS sheet. Both of those are also on our web site for your reference.

We sincerely appreciate your interest in our bedding products!"

One good thing, they are a local company. : )


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## littlelovesmousery

My his response was very politically correct lol. I really don't think there should be any reason why you can't use the big bales of it.


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## Frizzle

So far I THINK I like it better than the other stuff. The way that it's shredded makes it really dense, but it's not compacted very much in the bale. So what you see is close to what you get. It doesn't settle very much, so the layer stays thick on the mouse floor. It doesn't stratify very much, aka, with the other stuff the poop settled to the bottom, with this stuff it seems to stay evenly mixed in throughout.


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