# Babies aren't liking the formula...



## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

My babies really don't seem to care for the formula that I got them... (For those who don't know, I have 6 babies that were rejected by their momma at 11 days - 12 now). They seem to have the idea of how to get it from the syringe I am using, but prefer to just ignore it.

Is there anything I can add to it to make it a bit more appetizing to them? A drop of vanilla maybe? Or at this age, is it really about the taste?


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Mix it with crumbled bread or cereal, really wet and slightly warm and smear it on your hand after you've held them and warmes them for while. they will get it al over them, and they're old enough to lick off themselves if nothing else. they will eat when they are hungry, but they need to be handled and warmed first. I ended up cupping my babies against my bare chest; it seemed to help, if you can stand that close contact to another species. I think the sound of my heartbeat may have helped. Stroke their belly with a cotton swab.

That's all I can think of; if they haven't been feeding well before the doe died, they may lack the vitality to feed under these circumstances.

I'm keep[ing the chat windoe open, if you want more immediate support...I'll be in and out as I do my mousework.


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## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

Thank you, moustress. I'm sorry I missed you in chat.

Earlier today I put the babies in a shallow dish with the formula coating the bottom and made them crawl around inside of it, and then overtop of one another... they're all still covered in it. Lol. I'm doing my best, and at the moment they look okay, but I don't feel like they're getting enough.

I believe they were feeding fine before the doe rejected them (she wasn't ill... she just got crabby and started beating them up).

I'll keep doing my best though!


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

LOL I'm back now!

Went up to the mousery to collect mousewares to wash in prep for feeding. My pied blue doe munched another litter, dangit! She's out of the breeding permanently. I think some of the ones that survived being half cooked to death had brain damage. I've seen some weird not-nice behavior from a good proportion of the survivors.


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## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

Aww, that's sad! I've had such terrible luck with my last three litters, its disheartening. And I feel awful because I've started wondering if the babies are being destroyed because I've been lacking something in their mom's diets... so I am picking it up and going to risk more waste, to make sure they are all getting enough, if not more than enough foods and proteins. I wish I'd thought of it sooner... but the babies are being eaten completely, with no trace of them leftover, so it makes me think that mom was really after the protein. That's three litters now that have had issues.

All that said - I finally found a foster! I put the remaining six babies in with one of my momma's that had actually destroyed several of her own, and was down to 4. There is a second pregnant doe (ready to pop any day) in that cage, as well as the buck for this round. He'll come out before the second round of pregnancies are delivered. All three of them were cleaning the remaining formula off of the babies, and all seemed well. I really hope it remains that way, but will keep a close eye on them.


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Good luck! I think the cleaning of the babies is a good sign; it shold make them smell less foreign to the buck. I'm surprised he wasn't after them, with them not being his. Mousie behavior is just so unpredictable!

Keep us posted.


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## Kage Davies (Dec 21, 2008)

If you think its the protein level you could try dog biscuits. Mini Markie type ones work well. Or rat treats. Or dried mealworms . My pinkies also started to disappear when my does felt I wasn't giving them a protieny enough diet; I bought them some live mealworms and they've not done it since.


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## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

Thank you. The pregnant and nursing does all get scrambled eggs as well as the occassional meal worm - not all of them like them, though. I guess I just wasn't giving them enough.

I've also started sprinkling a bit of the formula powder on their food, as I read that can be good for them. I've upped the amount of eggs they get each day.

And all of my mice, regardless of pregnancy or not, get a high protein dog food kibble every day. This is the first time I've had a streak of 'destruction' like this, so its only a theory, but it certainly can't hurt to up the levels of food as long as I monitor weights. 

As of this afternoon, all babies are doing well. And surprisingly enough, it is the doe that has not yet given birth who is nursing them all... she has never had babies before. So, there is the answer to that question! First time moms CAN start lactating before giving birth.


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Too much protein can be harmful to meeces; you might want to take a minute to calculate what you're giving them.

That's very interesting, Bella, that the new mom-to-be is nursing pups. So, it's not just anyone's imagination (like mine ).


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## bethmccallister (Mar 5, 2010)

> First time moms CAN start lactating before giving birth.


Awesome!


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## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

How exactly would I go about calculating that?

They certainly weren't getting much to begin with (eggs). One or two small pieces each, per pregnant doe. I've bumped it up by about double that so they should each be getting about 4 pieces each, now. Do you think that is too much? They also only get a few kibbles each, of the dog food. And the meal worms are a rare treat, since I have other critters who need them!


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## Kage Davies (Dec 21, 2008)

Actually, I'd like to know too since mine get waaaaaaaaay more protein than that o.o. If I'm giving them too much I'll have to cut back.


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## Bella (Aug 15, 2010)

Kage, do you mind if I ask what you're feeding yours? I'm still so new to this...


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## Kage Davies (Dec 21, 2008)

I feed them high quality dog kibble and some dried mealworms in their main mix; which is normally a hamster/hamster/rat food mix since I can't get the seperate ingredients at the moment. Then the pregnant, nursing and growing mice get a special seed mix which is budgie seed mix, finch seed mix, hemp, a few more dried mealworms and some odds and ends of pumkin seeds and dried veggies etc. Millet and hemp are high protein and there's quite a portion of those in there. And then sometimes they get live mealies now and again, since they love them. Mine are getting too chubby on this diet right now though, so I'm still tweaking what they get.


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