# My first baby bird Orphan of the year(R.I.P =( )



## GibblyGiblets

Well, bright and early this morning I recieved my first baby bird of the year, a friend of mine called me and told me that she had be given a baby bird that a friend of hers found laying under a tree in her front yard with the nest destroyed around it and adult bird feathers all over the yard =I

It's a baby robin, my guess is less than two days old. I've gotten it to eat once since I've had it (for all of an hour) after it was nice and warm, ofcourse it'll be touch and go for the next few days, it's breathing seems to be a bit iffy =/

BUT ofcourse, the timing couldn't be worse lol, currently I'm not working so I've got plenty of time to raise it NOW, but I'll have my hands full for atleast the next two months with the little dude if it lives, and I'm planning on moving in 3-5 weeks, and around that time it'll start fledging, and when I'll move I'll need to prety much get a job imediately.

anyways, tentitive first picture and I'll update in a couple days!









and yes, I am going to raise to release, while it's not illigal here to raise robins, it is to keep them.


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## Frizzle

Do robins imprint at all? We raised a pigeon once (starting right before it opened it's eyes) and it would land on our shoulders and tap on the window to be let in.


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## Rhasputin

Are you in the UK?


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## GibblyGiblets

No, I'm in the US,

and Frizzle all birds will imprint, some are worse about it (for example, you can't release human imprinted starlings, grackles, Jays, crows ect. because they ae all highly social birds, and learn how to be birds from from their parents. I have raised several robins in the past, and a couple have imprinted on me, but they eventually go their own way.

I plan on keeping interactions with this one to a minimum (but you know how that goes xD)

he's doing somewhat better, his reaction is a bit off, and it takes a few times to get him to gape long enough to be fed, but once he does get it right, he eats with typical baby bird gusto


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## Frizzle

Our pigeon tried mating with our heads a couple times and sometimes would get in a fight with my hand over who got my ear. : / Interesting to know that robins don't do it so severely! Have you had any come back, or once their gone they stop associating with you?


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## Rhasputin

I'm not saying this to be mean, but do you have a permit? Robins are classified as songbirds and are possession is federally regulated, so you'll want to be careful about raising one if you don't. Technically even picking a feather up off the ground is a violation of federal law. Yikes!


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## GibblyGiblets

I did have one(or so I think as the same bird) who for every day for over 5 years would sit on the exact same place of the fence, it would allow me to get unusually close before flying off, it even raised a few clutches close to the house, there is one bird who still does ths bt I'm not sure it's the same one because that bird would be about 13 years old now, and I'm not sure how long they live.

as far as raising them goes, Iknow they're songbirds, BUT in my area there is only one "rehabber" who actually is also breds/raises/recues parrots. and so she doesn't LIKE to/doesn't take in a lot of wild birds, so, so long as you notify the local humane society (which I have) that you have a songbird in your posession and that you ensure you intend to release it (unless it's a pest species, starling/house sparrow ect.) then they have no problem with it.


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## Rhasputin

I have no problem with you raising it, I'm glad they let you. 

I doubt the feds are going to come knocking at your door, though it is still technically against the law.

I used to raise baby birds and squirrels from my yard, the laws don't make sense here. Just making sure you knew!


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## GibblyGiblets

Here's an update!, Meet Derpychirp! xD it is now about a week old, it's eyes have opened and it has a few feathers starting to come through, in another week it'll start trying to "fledge", at that point it'll be spending alot of time outside, learning to be a bird.

I've started familiarizing it with a certain sound when I feed it (that way I can find it while it's outside)


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## Loganberry

Core! That's massive! Bit different looking to our robins!


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## WoodWitch

Aaaah, wonderful. You're obviously doing a fab job of the hand feeding. Well done. I had a bash at hand rearing a chipmunk recently but was unsuccessful, as is the case so often. Continued good luck!


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## Seafolly

Oh wow. I tend to get one of these guys every year (either a House Sparrow or a Starling which aren't protected). Looks like you're doing great! Though I thought I'd add that imprinting is kind of going to happen whether you want it to or not. Fortunately I've never had a huge issue with it. They'll imprint enough to watch my hand "peck" at seeds or bugs but when ready to fly (without crashing) instinct takes over. Great job learning the songs! Extremely critical at the sensitive period of development. I also liked to put the bird (caged) near a flock of his own species if I could manage it to hear it from them themselves.

Edit: Oh, you made your own song, haha. Okay try and get recordings of Robin's singing to one another. That stuff should be easy to find. I threw the clips into a playlist and would loop it for the nestling. If they don't learn them (and you're in that sensitive learning development stage now) they'll have trouble finding a mate and recognizing calls of alarm etc etc.


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## GibblyGiblets

Seafolly xD I CAN do a top notch robin fledgling call LOL, but otherwise nada xD, I keep my window open as much as possible, there are always robins around hunting for worms/interacting so lots of vocals, I do plan on looking for robin calls starting to play them as well.

I'm trying my hardest to not get attached, simply because I can;t keep him, if it were a Starling I'd be all over loving it up xD, I used to have a starling and would love another.


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## Seafolly

That's great!  I never really worried too much about my birds not being able to reproduce (aside from the fact they'd be dead if I didn't find them, our country doesn't need more House Sparrows or Starlings...they're not protected for a reason!). But with a Robin I'd definitely be all over that song lesson. 

I remember crying when giving up my first bird. That one was a Starling and I actually only just gave him to a licensed rehabber. No one wanted him when he was little as Starlings are pests here. So I raised him until he could fly, then handed him to a rehabber who had a few Starlings in an outdoor aviary and was releasing them soon. The plan was to get him to bond to them first. He would return to her sometimes but was happy to leave with his new friends.

The second one went the same way. A House Sparrow, people would only offer to euthanize. So I raised him until he could fly, then brought him to the same woman. I never heard back but given she raises birds every year for release including hawks, I trust he was released properly. That was difficult too.

The third bird, another sparrow, I had to release on my own. That was very, very challenging given my neighbourhood is full of cats and he took much longer to learn how to fly. I think I had him another month just to ensure he could steer properly! He had no trouble flying off though and I was happy to see him soar up into a Japanese Maple. I hope he's alright. When raised in captivity, particularly if you have pets around for them to adapt to, it's very difficult to ensure survival given no bird is around to teach them how to hunt. He had very good instincts thought and caught the bugs I released in his cage so I have hope he's out there somewhere.

I don't miss the poop though.  When they're little it's nice and tidy in a sac. When they grow up it's everywhere! Especially when giving flying lessons! It's tricky to get them to trust you just enough to come back to you in necessary (like if they divebomb into a rose bush) but fear you enough so that they don't trust other people.


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## GibblyGiblets

I honestly don't see why Starlings are considered "pests", infact I read somewhere once that they've actually been in North america an all long enough that they are considered native.

I long to have another, they are actually awesome little birds to have as pets, smart and very playful.

I had mine for only about 7 months unfortunately, a close neighbor had been painting his barn, and the birds cage was beside the window which I always had open since it was summer,and I guess the vapors from the paint came through and that's what killed him, I was heart-broken.

at any rate, all the poop and the fact that they eat CONSTANTLY will make it all worth it once I see him fly off


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## Seafolly

Nope, they were brought over from Europe. They're pretty nasty up where I am. They routinely visit other nests and toss out the eggs or babies. Every year they raid the sparrow nest above my window, knock out the babies, and move on.  And they go after the Robin nests near one of our ponds where they like to build. It's why Canadian law doesn't protect them and why no shelter will bother raising them - the native birds are preyed upon. I don't like them personally, but I couldn't ever just leave a helpless nestling to die no matter what the species.

I did consider keeping the little guy as a pet (especially to prevent him from doing what he's built to do!) but I prefer to see birds out in the wild.  It'd be another thing if I had an aviary but I live in a city.

Ohhhh nooo.  That poor bird. That sounds awful!

It's funny you mention that, as I'm just moving back into my parents' house for the summer where I raised the nestlings and I'm finding all sorts of poop splotches that I missed! 0.0 On the plus side, it kept my sister from raiding my stuff.


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## Frizzle

House sparrows and Starlings are non-native species from Europe. Some guy wanted all the birds in Shakespears novels to be in America as well, and it took him almost a dozen tries, but he succeded. You might be mistaken or use a different common name. We used to call the Starlings Grackles (a native species that is entirely black with a shiney blue head and really wierd light colored eyes).

"Long enough" to be naturalized? It's actually illegal to release them into the wild, but I think maybe the hosue sparrows are. And some species of water fowl. But don't quote me on the last two, I only know so much!


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## GibblyGiblets

Grackles and Starlings are completely different, Grackles belong to the same family as crows/jays ect.

Starlings arn't protected anywhere in North america, but I swear by it that I've read SOMEWHERE that some people consider them a native species for having been here for a couple hundred years, anyways, I used to not care for them for a long time, foun them quite annoying, but having owned one, I dare say besides Jays, they are one of my favorite birds, not as demanding as a hook-bill (parrot, parakeet ect) and not nearly as boring as a canary! :lol:


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## Frizzle

Yup, I know. What confused people is that they are both "similar" sized black birds. Our family had switched what what was for at least one generation, so when I went to college for natural resources, I learned that we'd messed up. It was a pain, I had to get on the comp with my dad and Google starlings to show which was which. Since then my family has all made an effort to get the names right, so now we have conversations like, "I'm gonna go shoot some grackles!" "Real grackles, or starlings?" "Oops, yeah, I meant starlings."

Also, saw two robins that smacked into the TNR doors and thought of Seafolly here. One died, and some guy ended up walking away with the stunned/messed up juvenile, probably to use it as girl bait.


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## Seafolly

Oh dear. 

That reminds me of a Blue Jay I witnessed on the weekend. He hit our kitchen window at some point, but I found him in the typical dead bird pose. Feet in the air, wings splayed out, eyes shut, beak wide open. Two hours later he was still there (I was stalling doing the clean up because I hate putting animals in the garbage and our ground is still frozen). And then...I watched him slowly get up! I was so sure he was dead! And he flew away eventually.  I kinda needed to see that after watching a Peregrine Falcon take down a Flicker. They're like cats and toy with their prey.  Was quite unimpressed with that experience. But yay for the jay!

In Canada, water fowl are heavily protected. It's just the House Sparrows, Starlings, and Pigeons that the law doesn't seem to care about. I'm told House Sparrows also raid nests but I've never seen it *shrugs*. Starlings are definitely not favoured in my family due to all the eggs and baby birds of species like Baltimore Orioles (very beautiful and rare in our area) that they destroy for the sake of destroying. Needless to say I was very unpopular when I raised one! I'd do it again, but I'd be happy if the bird never reproduced, haha.


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## GibblyGiblets

Not saying anyone is lying, for sake of saying so, I'd like to point out that Starlings are cavity nesters, meaning that they will NOT nest in open nests, I personally have never witnessed a starling destroying a nest of another cavity nesting birds (infact don;t really know of any except woodpeckers).

alot of people also confuse brown headed cow birds for starlings (same size pretty much, and similar noises) cow birds ARE parastic and only lay their eggs in other birds nests, and will destroy eggs/kill chicks when they find them, I remember coming across the poor bodies of 7 baby house wrens one day in our garage, the wrens had made their nest on top of a bunch of fake flowers that were inside a plastc bad hanging on the wall, well there was something fluttering around in the bag, I thought it was the wren parent, nope it was a cowbird.

another incident where a group of cowbirds were literally tearing a robin fledgling apart, I have hated them ever since

but for argument sake (or to prevent one as it were) we all have our own opinions =)

another update in a couple days


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## Seafolly

Yep, I definitely think you're right. The starlings in our area only nest between the walls of our barn, or up under the eaves on the house. Definitely cavity. I think they destroy the other nests just to remove competition. *shrugs* Not necessarily for the nesting site. Even the sparrow nest they raid every spring above my window which they sometimes occupy, isn't something they move into after booting out the sparrow nestlings.

Here's a funny scenario: when I was cleaning out our Mallard duck nests (we install them over the ponds) I found a Canada Goose egg on top of unhatched Mallard eggs this past winter....! How weird is that? I have no idea what the goose was thinking, lol. They coexist well with the ducks so I guess the goose wanted to try the nest on for size and realized that oops, she's too big.

Anyway, I don't think anyone intends to argue about bird habits...?? It'd be one heck of a pointless argument. I'm glad you're nursing the starling. I've said it twice before in this thread that even though I dislike their species and what they do to other birds, I don't regret raising the one I did.


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## Frizzle

^^^
It's a robin she's raising. And geese have this weird thing where they will roll anything that is round and shiney into their nests. Some researchers tested this out, and the geese even rolled a lightbulb into the nest. They prolly either took over the mallard nest or were close enough to see the eggs and steal them.

I've also never seen Starlings destroying nests, but in my ornithology class it was a topic of discussion. Here's a link to an article where they caught some starlings in the act of taking over the nesting cavity of a flicker.
http://news2.onlinenigeria.com/worl...tarlings-stole-a-nest-in-violent-fashion.html


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## Seafolly

Oh yeahhhh. Why are we talking about starlings again? x)

Dang goose, haha. I had no idea about that tendency to hoard weird stuff. Cool! I have no idea what function it serves but maybe they just feel super maternal ; ) Our Mallard nests are in horizontal mesh cylinders stuffed with hay suspended above the water, very hard to see any eggs unless you have your arm in there, but maybe this one got curious. Definitely didn't work out since neither species of egg hatched!


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## GibblyGiblets

just a quick picture before I have to leave this morning.

9 days old abouts, it's got alot more feathers now, including on it's chest, and no longer needs a hot water bottle to keep it warm.

it now eats about every 10 minutes x_x an it eating inbetween 4 and 7! pieces of cat food at a time each feeding.

the only thing that concerns me at this point in that inbetween 2 and 3 weeks it'll start wanting to "fledge" and be alot more mobile, and up to this point, it hasn't really started trying to stand, and it's left leg splays out to the side, as well as it's forth toe on that foot is folded and very stiff.

(note that it has been prove that many of the robins in this area are highly inbred due to a massive crash the population had in this area about 80 years ago, for a long time many birds were hatching with extra toes (polydactle) which just like in cats is a sign of inbreeding)


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## Frizzle

I love it when baby birds start to feather out! Why was there a population crash?


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## Laigaie

Polydactylism in cats is a dominant gene, to my understanding. An outcrossed population would still have many polydactyl cats. There is another type that's recessive, but it's not nearly as common. That kind has the fetus growing whole extra feet from the ankle downward, with the second set almost always deformed and useless.

I was aware of the nationwide population disruptions caused by DDT, but that wasn't so long ago. What happened in the thirties?


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## GibblyGiblets

I'm not exactly sure, as I wasn't even alive 80 years ago o3o I just know alot of the older folk around here say that robins were just dropping dead (kinda like what was happening with the Starlings last year and this year I believe? ) not sure. I'm pretty sure it was localized *shrug* either way research was done around here some years ago, mist netting and such robins in the breeding season and more than 60% of the population in this area is related, some of them by more than a few individuals, and from my understanding inbreeding birds in the wild is incredibly hard due to the constantly changing population.

once again, I have no idea, just going on what I've been told.


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## GibblyGiblets

Here we are, 12 days old! eats like a little piggy...every...5...MINUTES >=I

it has started to flap around, and exersize it's wings, HOPEFULLY in a couple days it'll start trying to get out of the "nest", though it's legs still concern me becausewhen I pick it up they splay to the sides.

hopefully things will work out, I may start trying to get it to perch on things, and see if it'll grip with it's feet.


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## Frizzle

If the legs don't work, are you going to have it pts, or are you thinking about having a super secret pet that may or may not be bird related?  You piqued my curiosity, and all I could find out about it is that sometimes adults will push deformed chicks out of the nest. Maybe ask the rehabilitation person if it's normal? Idk, I'm rooting for you and your bird!


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## GibblyGiblets

If the legs don't work (it can stand and all and the legs aren't constantly out to the sides) then I honestly don't know. I know I can't keep it (I'm getting ready to move in a few weeks and starting a new job, so I'd have no time for a special needs pet of any kind, infact I have a special needs cat whom I'm thinking about re-homing for the very reason that I won't have time to properly care for her..)

anyways, I'm gonna try the perching like I said, and if the legs don;t stay undrneath I'll try wrapping them (the same thing you do for poultry with spread-leg) and if that doesn't work I'll have to figure out something else


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## SarahC

it's fairly easy to soft splint the most awful looking feet with great results,not sure on the legs but if in a week or so you think it's not looking good I'll gladly pass on the details of the person who helped me.I adapted his instructions and made splints from Mcdonalds straws,it really was simple.


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## SarahC

and now,not the best pic as the bird is squatting over it's feet but you can just about see them.


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## GibblyGiblets

Here's another quick update.

I talked to the local "bird lady" this morning, and explainedthe situation with the birds feet,(she actually didn't offer much help, only to half-arsedly tell me that he' probably better off PTS -_-) his fourth toe is folded under the first three, and the bone has actually fused th toe is completely stiff, the three other toes work, and he can even kinda perch ith effort, and when he canget a traction he can walk.

So I decided to wrap his legs in a simple way you d with aby poultry who have spraddle leg.


































he's happy little camper now that he can actually stand, he bounced around my bed for over an hour. hopefully I can straighten his legs out, and even if he can;t perch the best he can so long as he can walk and fly he will hopefully be fine.


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## Shadowrunner

You know it would be a shame to put him down after all that effort you invested.
I've rehabed a few of them before and it's a total pain in the rear sometimes.

I'm sure if you think he'd be okay as a special needs pet that someone would take him if you couldn't.


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## SarahC

I'm going to dig out the old emails from the person that helped me and copy and paste them here.Your birds feet are much better than my birds and mine has full use of the feet now.Unfortunately mine also had a problem with the hips so can't ever be released.


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## GibblyGiblets

Shadowrunner said:


> You know it would be a shame to put him down after all that effort you invested.
> I've rehabed a few of them before and it's a total pain in the rear sometimes.
> 
> I'm sure if you think he'd be okay as a special needs pet that someone would take him if you couldn't.


It would be, and (even though I said I WASN'T going to) I am getting attached, the way he looks at me sometimes, or when he settled down on my lap and just sits there staring up at me 

It's kinda like having a kid, I guess =I you raise them and wish them the best, hope they can grow up and one day go on their own.

he's so determined now, even without his legs bound he still jumps and trys to perch, I'm trying a different method of the bindig this time as I donlt like how the band-aid stick to the legs -_-.

I honestly have no idea what I'm gonna be able to do, the rehabber seems out of the question because she doesn'r seem all that interested in taking him in (infact she told me she turned down several other babies in favor of her parrots >.>)


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## Shadowrunner

parrots are overrated. I had a mourning dove for years and she was much more cuddly than the cockatoo.

I don't know, he is adorable though. I'm surprised at how quickly his plumage is coming in :3
Finches stay pretty much bald until right before they fledged. Or at least mine did.


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## GibblyGiblets

15 days today and we've had lots of first, for starts his first "real" flight, which consisted of fluttering about 5 feet, and crash-landing on his head.

I've been taking him outside asmuch as possible lately, my hopes are still to be able to release him though I very seriouly doubt he'll be able to be because he's become a bit TOO tame =I

his perching i getting better too!, the ban-aid worked like a charm...until it got dirty, then it was a pain in the you know what to remove, so his legs have not been bound since yesterday.


























(yes, that isa pair of pliers xD, it makes feedig easier because they mor accurately mimic an adults beak.)


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## Frizzle

That last picture is funny, if a bird has ever looked down it's beak, that is what he is doing. He looks like a crazy old man with the remnants of his baby down on his head like that. With all this bird business, I thought of you today when I caught this mourning dove bashing around in my porch screens. I let it go and it flew away with it's mate.


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## GibblyGiblets

Today is three week update, I have had Derpychirp for 3 weeks today.

I have watched this little creature go from a helpless little pink blob to a bird who is rapidly growing in both size and independance.

his legs are slowly fixing themselves, and only occasionally will his left leg slip out to the side, he can hold both legs under him, he can perch properly (if the branch is thick enough), even though his feet are still messed up and more than likely always will be.

he has even started pecking at bugs when he is outside

he spends most of his time outside exploring now (I'm still hopeful that he will be fuctional enough to release but I doubt it), while he's still tame, he's slowly growing apart from me. he goes where he wants, and when I come around to feed him I make my call and he calls back.

the only thing he's still not really doing is flying. he can fly both virtically and horizontally about 10 feet, but h doesn't really try otherwise.









(about 6 feet up on his favorite outside feeding branch, he got there himself)









(occasionally his leg slips out to the side)

he's actually quite the little mooch too! I caught him begging from an adult robin earlier (who had her on three younger chicks) she had none of it and promptly sent him off.

he's also grown increasingly picky lately which has resulting in him loosing quite a bit of wieght over the last couple days, when he don't want to eat he won;t eat, but I'm working on forcing him to eat each time I try to feed him, I peste until he eventually takes the food.


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## GibblyGiblets

Another update on Derpychirp he is 25 days old today, no pictures this time unfortunately, BUT some rather good news.

he MAY be able to be released after all!, his perching and flight has gotten considerably better over thepast few days, and today he has spent nearly the entire day hanging out in the trees, only coming down to be fed.

he also had a close call with the cat today, he was not hurt, but it certainly scared him enough, where before he showed no fear around the cats, he now perks right up when he sees them.

tonight will be a fitfull one for me, if I cannot call him down, he will spend his first night outside, in a tree =I

EDIT:
Well, he wouldn't come down, not even being coaxed with food, so I guess we'll see if tonight will be the turning point for him, if he survives or not, I'll hve to make sure I get up early in the morning(even though I WANTED to sleep in -_-) lest he find himself on the ground, and my grandfathers cat finds him.


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## GibblyGiblets

I am absolutely torn apart.

I went out this morning, to find a happy little bird bouncing around the trees, and as I was calling him down for breakfast (I was also gonna put a band on his leg) he caught someone elses attention.

Let me tell you, that was the first time I've ever kicked a Kestrel....they literally came down RIGHT infront of me.

He wasn't hurt, but he'd been having fits, I finally decided to put him down.

a bit of Ether in a bowl in closed up box and he was gone within a few seconds.

I somehow feel as though it was MY fault, if I had of gone out a few minutes later or earlier, I might not have attracted so much attention to him.


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## SarahY

I'm sorry to read this after all your hard work with him 

Don't blame yourself sweetie; there's no way you could possibly have known there was a kestrel around xxx


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## MojoMouse

That's sad for you, especially as the little guy was thriving against the odds under your care.


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## tinyhartmouseries

I cursed a bit when I read the new title! I am really sorry, been watching this with interest!


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## Frizzle

Really sorry to hear : ( At the very least, be happy that you gave the bird a chance, and that he helped you learn a lot in case another little bird needs your help.


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## Motorab

SarahC said:


> it's fairly easy to soft splint the most awful looking feet with great results,not sure on the legs but if in a week or so you think it's not looking good I'll gladly pass on the details of the person who helped me.I adapted his instructions and made splints from Mcdonalds straws,it really was simple.


Dear Sarah,

Please help me with a simlar problem. I have a crrow from sunday and 
I found a few days ago a crow (2 months) with a crooked claw . Step inside with a claw..

I want to make for him a prothesis and I need advice.. 
I noticed that you did with some straw from McDonald's but I do not realize how you have installed..

How long has healed claw?

I wait your answer


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## SarahC

hello,I cut the straws in half horizontally,lay the toes inside and strapped/taped them into position.Simple but effective.Poultry chicks are often splinted.might be worth googling for some pictures and ideas.Wish you very good luck,I still have my crow


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## Motorab

Thank you for the details.
After how many days the crow was healed?


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## SarahC

5 days,the bones are soft and mend quickly.


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