# Agouti siamese?



## lindberg4220 (Oct 30, 2008)

Is there such a thing? I was told my siamese male Sugar Daddy is agouti siamese, but i just can't find anything about that variety - all articles says siamese is based on black, nothing on agouti.

This is the mouse in question, Sugar Daddy:




























His parents are bluepoint siamese and burmese fox LHS.

To me he looks like a pretty normal siamese, with moltlines atm.


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## Jack Garcia (Oct 9, 2009)

Agouti-based siamese (A/* c^h/c^h) is mealy, weak-colored, and somewhat "washed out" like the mouse you've posted. However, poor siamese in general are like that. Here is a picture of how black a siamese mouse's points are supposed to be: http://www.repage7.de/memberdata/drofi/P4043799-1.jpg

Since he has a blue parent, that can also affect the weakness of his points.

Here is an agouti-based himalayan I accidentally bred in an outcross:


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## lindberg4220 (Oct 30, 2008)

WOW! I absolutely LOVE that almost black pointing 

In Denmark the serious fancymice breeding is pretty new, and almost all our mice are of pet-type and size, but we are some breeders importing mice and trying to breed some size and better types in 

My Sugar Daddy is one of the darkest pointed siameses here in DK, so you se we have a long way to go. We don't even have a club yet, but hopefully we will get one in a few years 

I have a himalayan female with nice dark points for a danish fancymice  Will i get darker points by breeding her to Sugar Daddy?

This is my himalayan; Caramia:


















She pregnant atm, so breeding her to Sugar wont be for at least 3 months.


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## WoodWitch (Oct 18, 2009)

He He....is that areal cat sneaking up on her????


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## lindberg4220 (Oct 30, 2008)

:lol: No, it's a picture on a box for catfood, I have two and use them for mice/gerbil food 

But I actually do have 4 cats which enjoy sleeping on the dining table, so it's not unusual to see rodentpics including a cat or 2 on rodentpics from me :lol:


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## icedmice (Oct 4, 2009)

Yep there IS such a thing. I think most ... if not ALL clubs don't recognise it as a standardised colour.

At one stage we had quite a few being used by fanciers here.

One of my founding does was an agouti himilayan:









She was sold to me as a siamese.....hmmm...
It wasn't until I started dabbling in genetics that I worked out she was an agouti in disguise!

If you breed your mouse to a black one (preferably with no c dilutes) and they produce agouti babies then it's agouti siamese. If not, it's unlikely it's agouti siamese. The resulting black bablies are still very useful in a shaded program because they'd all carry siamese. 
This is how I'm going about my program at the moment, but I'm trying to breed those annoying fox bellies out of our shaded mice.


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