# Babies! Now with Pictures!



## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

My mouse Ash had a litter last night, only two pups. She's nine months old, and I had just taken her out of the male's cage for retirement. I didn't think she was pregnant, and she wasn't fat, so I was quite surprised. Both are BE, the father is my chocolate Christopher, and this is his first litter. Ash is agouti, so I'm really hoping for a couple cinnamon, maybe broken because Ash carries the broken gene, not sure about Christopher. She was really exhausted after this litter. I didn't realize how old she was until I looked it up. I think I'll wait a couple days before I get pics, give her time to recover first. From now on, I'll just use her as a nanny for my other mice. Ash is the first baby I ever bred, born Oct. 10, 2009.


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

Congrats on the litter  
Im glad she didnt have any problems, I would be nervous about breeding a 9 month old doe, but I know some other people do with no problems


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Like I said, I didn't know how old she was until I looked it up. And I removed her from the boy's cage, she wasn't there for long, but long enough, I guess.


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

It doesnt take long for some of them,lol.


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

I think one of my other mice is giving birth today. She's huge, and today she's acting very uncomfortable, keeps cleaning herself and nesting.


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## miss.understood (Apr 20, 2010)

Congrats x


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Still no babies from Sera, the other mouse I was talking about, but I keep checking every morning and night! I have another, Dru, who is very pregnant. I didn't think she was due for another week, but the past couple days she got HUGE, so she might be due sooner than I thought. Of Ash's babies, both are getting darker, one getting darker than the other, so that one might be black. The other, maybe agouti or cinnamon or chocolate. Ash is A/a so anything is possible!


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Why is it that when things go bad with mice, they go really bad, really fast?
And when things go okay with them, they go pretty okay as well?

Here's my story:
Ash only had two, as I've already said. Odd, but not entirely unexpected, given taht she's old and didn't even look pregnant at time of birth.

Sera finially gave birth last night, I swear I thought babies were going to start bursting out of her ears soon if she didn't. She had 11 babies, and she is also older, being the second baby I bred, born 11/19/09. She's eight months olds, and I'm going to retire her as well. I'm particularly interested in her babies, as the father, Frost, was a mystery agouti of some sort, but he died not long after I serperated them. I swear it was heartbreak or something, he had food and water, and I don't think he was old. So this is his only litter. Sera is a black who carries broken. 4 are PE, and 7 are BE.

Dru, my other black pregnant doe, also started giving birth this morning. I looked in, saw she was giving birth, and left her alone for about 6 hours. I check back, and right away I see that there is a baby outside the nest by itself. So I think, well, at least one dead, must be something wrong with it, a disappointment, but there are other babies. So went I go to remove it, it moves. And I thought, hey, it's still alive! It was stone cold and no milk belly, but I didn't see anything wrong with it, so I figure I'd put it back in the nest and Dru won't notice. So I look in the nest, and there are only three babies. That was more disappointing to me, but oh well. Except when I went to put the baby back, they were all cold. That's when alarm bells start going off in my head. I pick up the babies, and all alive, all cold, no milk bellies. And, looking around, I see another two babies that are still alive, cold, and not fed. I pick them all up, and hold them in my hand to warm them. Dru's not taking care of them, and I don't know if I should leave them in there, or take them out. I can't hand rear them, my schedule doesn't allow for it. Now I don't know if I should foster them with Sera, who has babies the same size, but has 11, so adding 6 more would be 17, or Ash, who only has 2, but her babies are already three times the size they were, would she kill the small newcomers?

Ash, if I haven't said before, if my favorite baby. She loves to ride around on my shoulder, and she's the one that always climbs into my hand without hesitation. So I decide to trust Ash. I get the babies warmed up, and put Ash's two with the new ones, as well as some of the nest bedding, and let them mingle a bit to get the scent in there. Then I put the babies back and waited to see what happened. She didn't immediately kill the babies, so I left them alone for a couple hours. When I checked again, all eight are warm in the nest, and they all have milk bellies now. Ash was a good choice, both for her personality and her small litter size. Her first pups are huge blimps compared to the tiny pink fish bait that just joined them, but she's taken them all in, and cleaned them up.

Good girl, Ash.


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

I forgot to say, but Dru was bred to a black long haired buck, who is also no longer with us. 2 are PE, 4 are BE.


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Ash's two have fur, and I'm a bit disapointed (and confused! :shock: ) There is one black boy, and one... something... girl. The girl is a light gray color, but it looks not exactly pure. Not that it's speckled or anything, but like sort of dusty. It's hard to describe, I might be able to get pictures in a couple days. The others that she's fostering are doing well. Their milk bellies were small at first, but I think Ash has adapted to the extra babies, and is producing more milk. I'm giving her more suppliments than usual, so I think this helps too. There are now 7 of them, I found three extra in Dru's cage when I looked again at her, one alive and the others half eaten, so I put the other one in with Ash as well.

My other babies are all doing very well. My oldest litter, from Dawn, should be opening their eyes any time now.


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## jujubee18 (May 21, 2010)

I bet the one that is a "dusty grey" is a brindle. I have a grey brindle :]
congrats :]


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Neither of the parents are brindles. I bred the mom myself, Ash is an agouti, so I know she doesn't have brindle, and the Christopher is a chocolate, so if he is brindle, it's very well hidden, as his coat is even colored without a hint of sootiness. I _think_ the strange baby might be a lilac, b/b AND d/d. I have a b/b D/d buck I might breed her to, to see what comes out. The buck's name is Michael, so I'm thinking of calling the doe Charity. It's a book reference.


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I demand pictures lol


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

I plan to! I plan to!

I'm at work now, LOL, and I don't think I'll get home until after dark, so I may or may not get pictures today!


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

Brindles can be unmarked.
Cant wait for picturea


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Do mice have colostrum like other mammals do? You know, how in the first hours after birth, the milk is creamier, more rich than normal milk? The reason I ask is because when I had to foster Dru's babies, I used Ash because she had a small litter. But her babies were already five days old at the time, so no colostrum. Now, even though Ash is nursing 9 and Sera is nursing 11, Sera's are just generally chubbier and more active than the 7 new ones in Ash's nest. Now I'm wondering if I made a critical mistake, in depriving the baby mice of colostrum. Remember, Sera's were born only a few hours before Dru's.

On the other hand, I sexed the litters today, and Dru's (Ash's) have 5 girls and 2 boys, which I'm very pleased about. Sera's litter also has 8 girls and 3 boys. I prefer girls to boys, of course, and so I'm happy with the girl heavy litters.

Of colors, so far all of Sera's, who are by Frost, an unknown agouti, are solid. Sera carries the broken gene, so I don't think Frost had the gene. As I said before, 4 of them are PE, and show no color so far. The others appear uniformly dark. If I have 4 PEW and 7 blacks, that will tell me nothing about what Frost was!

Of Dru's, 2 are PE, showing no color so far, and 4 are uniformly dark. 1 is a lighter color, not dark but not light either. I'm really looking forward to what that one could be. It's BE, so what are BE non-agouti dilutions? So far I've come up with chocolate, blue, and lilac. I think it's too dark for lilac, and too light for blue. The next days should tell.


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

Yes, mice produce colostrum
If Frost is an agouti, should some of the babies be agouti?
Liliac be light and blues can be dark so you can still have a chance for either. Ive found that if your not breeding for a certain color(blue,chocolate,etc) then the shade can range a ton.
Wow you got lucky, I usually end up with way more males then females,lol.


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Yeah, I got lucky this time around, but my last three litters all have like 2 girls and the rest all boys, lol, it does even out eventually.

Okay, I know I owe everyone pictures, and here they are!

Here is Sera's little. Looks like 2 black, 4 PEW, and 5 agouti.









Size difference between Sera's litter and Dru's.









Here are Dru's. Unfortunately, right after this picture was taken, my dog jumped on the table and killed one of the PEWs.









Ash and Dru's together, you get the size difference at once.









Here are Ash's two babies, so what is that grey baby in front?


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Ash's older litter have eyes now! The grey girl is grey, with brown tips on her back... Still don't know what she is!

Mysti, broken chocolate doe, had pups today! The father is TJ, who I now wonder might be cinnamon... Anyway, Mysti is a/a b/b, and TJ is A/a */b... So I expect cinnamon and chocolates, and if I get black or/and agouti, I'll know TJ is B/b. He's produced chocolate babies before, off Mercy my blue doe, so I know he carries chocolate, his color is just so strange no one can tell me what he is!

Anyway, Mysti has 10 babies, 9 BE and one PE. Pictures in a couple days, I PROMISE!!!


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

Im sure someone can tell you what TJ's color is,lol.
Can you post a picture fo him again? 
What color is Ash? Who was she bred to?
I always get so confused in your posts,lol


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## miss.understood (Apr 20, 2010)

the grey baby is.....GORGEOUS! thats what that is! lol xxx


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Here are the pictures I promised. Cordelia, my satin black tan, also gave birth to 11 babies. The father is Christopher, my chocolate buck that has several other litters due imminently. I'm going to use the does of this litter to breed to my satin buck Darcy, and hopefully get a whole mess of satins I can use to spread to my other lines. Mysti, sadly, ate 4 of her babies. As a first time mother, maybe she couldn't handle 10 at once. Of the ones that remain, 4 have shadow spots already, and I'm pleased by that. Of Dru's litter, when I tried to take pictures, three of them jumped in three different directions, and I only managed to catch two. The other I couldn't find that day. By the next... my dog and cat had found her  This litter just has not had much luck. They are noteably smaller and slower in developement than Sera's litter, and I'm wondering if I should cull the whole lot.

Sera's PEWs









Sera's blacks









Sera's agoutis...? I've never seen this shade of agouti before. Frost, the father, looked the same way. I like the more golden colored agouti, better than this silvery one.









All of Sera's babies









Charity, Ash's girl that I'm keeping









Ash's older babies









Mysti's babies


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## windyhill (Jan 19, 2010)

Aww


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## Onyx (May 2, 2010)

Gorgeous!


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## nuedaimice (May 26, 2010)

It kind of looks like the two in the top corner of the photo of Mysti's litter might have spots? And I love those silver agoutis! All of your bubs are beautiful!


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Thanks! Yep, the top two have the most striking spots, but by now 4 of them have a fairly good amount of color. What's the genotype of silver agoutis? I was assuming that they were a different shade of A* B* etc... but are they a different genotype as well? I thought briefly they might be chinchillas, but chins are cch/cch, right?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Chinchilla by show standards should be genetically either Aw/Aw cch/cch *or* A/at cch/cch because chinchilla's need to have a white belly 

However... silver agouti's are A/* cch/cch... chinchillated agouti's. And I think they are gorgeous!! lol

W xx


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## Lottiz (Feb 8, 2010)

Oh!!! Sweeties :*
I'm waiting for my chinchilla female to breed but I also waiting for my Ar cr to breed. All my chinchillas are A/at cch/cch and some are P/p.

-L


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

See now, the dad, Frost, looked exactly like the babies, and he was crossed to Sera, my black female. So far as I know, she doesn't carry cch, though it is possible... Maybe they're just a different shade of regular agouti? Also, had another birth today, Gypsy is a black tan, bred to Christopher the chocolate. I'm hoping for black and chocolate tans, as well as being able to tell if Gypsy is a/at or at/at. Don't have a count, just glanced in the window and saw pink squirming things. Again, pictures in a couple days.


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Gypsy had 13 babies! I'm letting her rest for a couple days, and then I'll get pictures of her. Meanwhile, here's updated pictures of everyone else!

Here are three girls, all different ages. The left one is an agouti tan from Dawn, my sooty RY. The middle one is Charity, from Ash's litter, who might be lilac??? The littlest one is an agouti baby from Sera's litter. See what I mean by the differnt shades? So what color is the little one???









Mysti's babies. Looks like 2 broken black and 2 broken chocolate, which means that TJ must be A/a B/b. Maybe he carries something on the C-loci that makes it hard to identify his color. Of the two that arn't shoing yet, one of PE, maybe PEW, one is BE, I'm hoping maybe RY, since I know TJ carries it.









For reference, this is what TJ looks like. If you know what color he is, please tell me!









Cordelia and her 11. So far they look all uniform dark.


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## zany_toon (Apr 3, 2010)

Aw I love the little silver agoutis and all the little wriggly pinkies (or ******* in the bottom piccie :lol


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

I'm afraid I have some bad news. Karrin, my siamese who was pregnant with Malcolm, another siamese, died during birth. When I found her in the morning, I was too late to do anything. I was really looking forward to this litter, all siamese, and it's taken me several days to write about it. I do have two of Karrin's daughters from Spike, which I put in with Malcolm to get siamese, I hope. One is a black tan, one is a broken... something. I thought siamese at first, but now I don't know. When I get a picture of her, I'll post it.

As for one bit of good news, Buffy, another black tan pregnant by Christopher, gave birth to 9 pups. That was a few days ago, so I'll get pictures up as soon as I have a day off.


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

How awful! I know how you feel...bummer...*hug*


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## zany_toon (Apr 3, 2010)

So sorry for your loss hun!! What a horrible thing to find


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## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Yeah, thanks everyone. I might name one of her siamese granddaughters after her. She really went too early.


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