# Well...



## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

This is a very fat and healthy baby from a recent litter of mine.










What colour would you call it? Bare in mind the fur is very very pale and the eyes are black. Black Eyed Cream? Yeah, thats what i'd call it too!!
So... WHY IS IT IN MY LILAC LINES?

I should know exactly what my lilac lines carry... this baby makes absolutely no genetic sense to me what so ever. The should be no c(e) in my lines at all.

As much as I love surprises... this one is not cool. Once again, C Locus... I hate you. LOL!

W xx


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## JustMouse (Jul 23, 2010)

Ivory?


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: 
I think your mice conspired to do it on purpose! They do it to me too..

Sarah xxx


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## JustMouse (Jul 23, 2010)

Maybe you had a mouse back in your lines somewhere that looked like a lilac but actually wasnt? I have no idea how two lilacs would make that baby. It's cute though!


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

My lilac lines are just thats... lines to *create* Lilac, I'm starting from scratch, as Lilac is not a popular colour over here.

My Lilac lines *should* have blue, choc, pink eye and albino in them and NOTHING else. The pink eye and albino is in thier because for my starting stock I used chams and cham bred PEW's for size and type.

But it seems lately, I have inadvertantly bred out the choc gene. And it also appears I have a rogue gene in there too!! Ian and Loganberry need to get thier bee-hinds in here! hehee

W xx


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## Jack Garcia (Oct 9, 2009)

Mine trick me, too!


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## NuttySian (Sep 1, 2010)

I snuck it in there as revenge for getting naughty mice! 

It's adorable though :love1


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## GypsyTails (Jul 14, 2010)

I must learn to swim better, so I can come snatch your surprises!


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## The Village Mousery (Aug 1, 2010)

i'm happy to know i'm not the only person to get the milkmouse's kids, pmsl


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## WNTMousery (Jun 2, 2010)

Just Mouse- Ivory in the US is the same as Black Eyed Cream overseas. c^e/c Which is one extreme dilute gene and one albino gene. I believe overseas they call Albino Satin "Ivory."


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## ian (Oct 3, 2008)

oh dear! C locus is a bitch.

Thats all I can say at the moment my brain is frazzled from work.


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

*jumps on Ian*

Did your blues have extreme dilute in them?? Did they?? Did they??? Huuuuhhhh?????

*laughs manically*

W xx


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## ian (Oct 3, 2008)

Not a chance (well theres always a bit of a chance I guess!) Although I was told by thier breeder that in the past the lines had thrown siamese although I never got one.


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

hmm... too pale for siamese, and if it was himi (because I know my lilacs have albino in them) it would have pink eyes.

I just want to be able to explain this baby! LOL I shall be texting heather next! *LMAO*

W xx


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## Jack Garcia (Oct 9, 2009)

Are you gonna keep this baby around to see how it develops?


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## The secret garden (May 13, 2010)

who did you get all your stock off of?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I will be keeping her around, I do want to make sure she is actually a BEC! In any event, I don't want to risk using her in my lilac lines, and have no use for her anywhere else, but mousemad has claimed her!! lol

And Sam... my Lilac lines are all decended from Ian, Heather and SarahY's mice. There is nothing else in there.

W xx


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## ian (Oct 3, 2008)

I think it was just blues from me wasnt it? I dont remember ever having any chocolates but might be wrong :/

My blues were from only two sources, and I didnt keep them very long only a year but I only started off with a trio of one lot and a trio of the other lot but only managed to get only one good enough baby from them and it was using the buck from the other trio. So I started off with a very small gene pool and never ended up with any c locus genes cropping up. I know its possible that the gene managed to keep itself hidden by luck but knowing both of the breeders I just dont see them providing animals without giving the full genetic history of the mice.


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Yup, blues from you Ian, Chams from SarahY and Cham bred PEW's from Heather is what went into these mice.


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## Taegan (Sep 13, 2010)

I like little surprises in my litters, prooves that we don't all know everything about mother nature


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

I've had the occasional PEW in my litters, but never stone or black eyed cream. I couldn't begin to imagine where that mouse came from!

Sarah xxx


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## The Village Mousery (Aug 1, 2010)

lol told you milkmouse's baby


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Sarah xxx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

How's my baby doin today? any new piccies???


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I took a photo today, please excuse the mess, I was feeding and cleaning out! lol Seeds and hay get everywhere. And yes, they are in a jug, they wouldnt stay still!!!!! *laughs*

From left to right: PEW, Dove... and it looks like a bloody BE Cream to me!!










Oh and by the way Gentia... it seems that she is actually a he, with small bits. *snorts* Still want him?

W xx


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## Jack Garcia (Oct 9, 2009)

So strange! Do keep us updated.


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## GypsyTails (Jul 14, 2010)

WillowDragon said:


> Oh and by the way Gentia... it seems that she is actually a he, with small bits. *snorts* Still want him?
> 
> W xx


Double whammy? Variety AND gender? Oy!


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## CatWoman (Jun 19, 2010)

I've heard that when there's pointing, staring, and a bit of maniacal laughter involved, manly parts can shrink right up to nothing... :lol:


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

:lol: :lol: 
I will still love he/she no matter, Maybe it's one of those 'undecided', I get them all the time and eventually they work out if they are a he or she  :lol:


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## Loganberry (Oct 24, 2008)

WillowDragon said:


> I will be keeping her around, I do want to make sure she is actually a BEC! In any event, I don't want to risk using her in my lilac lines, and have no use for her anywhere else, but mousemad has claimed her!! lol
> 
> And Sam... my Lilac lines are all decended from Ian, Heather and SarahY's mice. There is nothing else in there.
> 
> W xx


Hiya! I havent read the whole thread, but Ian keeps rumpwhites so there will be various things in those lines, including tan, and the chams youve had from sarah are out of silvers from me, mixed with her original stock that included selfs out of brindle breeding from Cait, which were argentes, and i believe there were fawns in caits mixes as well, and i think she put cream into the brindles to improve type as well, so you do have a lot more in there than you probably realise.


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Argente, fawn, rumpwhite and tan are all dominant, so i def dont have those in here... But creams used way back for type could definately explain a rogue dilute gene!

Thanks Heather!


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## Loganberry (Oct 24, 2008)

Also, no mice in the fancy are 'pure' - there's all sorts of things in everything.

I have silvers in my garage that probably carry black, cream, cham, PEW, satin and argente, and less than half of that was my doing, and that's only what i definitely know about. When i breed my silvers together, i only get silvers, but Sam, who's silvers regularly throw chams, gets chams from crosses of mine into hers, so i know mine must carry cham but don't produce it in my garage; the strength of the cham in Sam's line must 'unlock' it in mine.

Lots of fun.


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## Seawatch Stud (Feb 8, 2009)

All the mice available today are genetically mongrels. Just because a mouse appears to be a given variety, dosent mean it isnt carrying god knows what. Since stock ceased to be available from labs some years ago, no true "genotypes"( I thtink thats right!) exist. Now the mice we have are only "phenotypes"(I think thats right too!"). So now no matter how many generations of mice you breed, no matter how "true" they breed, you can never be sure they are not carrying something that will ruin your best laid breeding plans!. In fact you can be sure they are!. I know nothing about genetics, so feel free to put me right.


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## ian (Oct 3, 2008)

Yeah my rumpwhites carry a bit of everything it seems althouigh the blues I gave to Katie were from a line of black and blue selfs I bred for a short time.

I think theres always going to be surprises cropping up unfortunately (or maybe fortunately depending what you get!)


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I was just surprised that nothing like this had turned up in my lines before now!
I wont be so confused in future!


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