# Housing Planning



## Anktian (Feb 4, 2013)

So I'm getting things prepared here at home so I can make a trip to the east coast and pick up some mice to start up my modest mousery and would absolutely love some input/feedback/suggestions from the experts here at Fancy Mice Breeders. 

I did some browsing of tubs and only found one brand at our local Walmart that seemed durable enough, available in all of the sizes I'm likely to need (from single buck to modest doe colony), and snap lock lids. I intended to buy these tubs, use a soldering iron to cut out a good portion of the lid and square "windows" in the front and back (also covered in mesh). I thought I would use zip ties to keep the mesh in place, but I'm concerned about the mice chewing through them. I've seen them used before, though, and figured it might be the easiest and safest route. I suppose that they're cheap enough to replace as long as I keep an eye on the bins and remember to keep a supply of them? I'm not sure on this.

In regards to mesh, what size squares would you recommend? I was thinking 1/4" x 1/4". Would that be small enough even for the younger guys?

I have been slowly building up a supply of water bottles, enrichment/exercise toys for them, etc. as well.

I originally intended to put at least one wheel in every bin, but I think I read somewhere that they don't really need them. If this is the case, I might leave them out of the does' bins and just put one in with each of the bucks' (since they'll be lonely fellas). With the wheels, I thought those silent spinners (such as this) would be safest in regards to their little feet and tails. What size would you recommend for fancy mice? I know that my Chinese Dwarf hamsters need a size up from the smallest or else it causes back troubles (I'd have to check the measurements on those).

I also was trying to think of things they could climb on that would be easy enough to attach to the mesh and those rope dog toys (such as these) seemed like they would be a good fit. I believe I've seen people use these, too, so figured they would be safe enough.

I'm trying to think of a safe way to build/add secondary levels to tall enough tubs that would be easy to clean, but I've not had any luck with ideas. Suggestions?

For nesting "boxes", I thought of using the exercise balls (such as these). I've got a fair supply of those that I originally bought for my hamsters, but soon quit using for the fact that Eric (the other half) would accidentally bump into them or they would run full force into a wall. I felt they were unsafe and discontinued use and now they're sitting around in a closet. Thought that cleaning them out really well and shoving them in the bins with tissue paper would provide a cozy little nest area. Thoughts on this?

I had also considered crating Popsicle stick creations that might help keep them active and give them things to climb on, but that would end up taking a lot of time (especially since they need replaced so frequently; at least with my hamsters). So I think I've more or less abandoned this idea. If I didn't work full time + part time, I'd probably be game for it.

Maybe you guys have some more suggestions for enrichment toys? I'd definitely appreciate it.

And bedding... I'm not quite sure what to do here. I'm wanting to use something that will firstly and most importantly be safe for them, but at the same time I want something pretty absorbent that will help keep odor down since the mousery will be sitting in my spare bedroom down the hall. I use a mixture of wood shavings and CareFresh Ultra (both frozen prior to use) for the hamsters and it seems to work well enough for them (and with no allergy issues which was my main concern). I will sometimes add a little timothy hay to the top as a treat (and also to give them something to rummage in). Would this work for mice as well or should I consider an alternative? If possible, I'd really like to do bedding in something that is safe for both my hamsters and the mice as it would be easiest on me, but am totally willing to use different materials if it would be better. Only the best. (;

I don't intend to use bowls in my mouse bins. I don't use them in my hamster cages since I prefer to scatter it in the bedding so they have to "forage" for it like they might in the wild. Besides, less cleaning makes for a much happier me. 

I think that's all I wanted to share (as far as housing goes, anyhow) that I was hoping to get feedback on. If you feel I'm lacking something they will need, please let me know. I'm here to learn and grow and I'd much rather do the learning and growing before I get the mice here. < 3

Thanks in advance, guys! I really look forward to your input.


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## ThatCertainGlow (Jun 23, 2012)

I am not an expert, but some of this I can answer, at least with my own opinion/understanding.



Anktian said:


> I thought I would use zip ties to keep the mesh in place, but I'm concerned about the mice chewing through them. I've seen them used before, though, and figured it might be the easiest and safest route. I suppose that they're cheap enough to replace as long as I keep an eye on the bins and remember to keep a supply of them? I'm not sure on this.


Yes, and yes, that does seem to be what those who use zip ties do. I've read of some breeders saying they are rarely, if ever, chewed off.



Anktian said:


> I was thinking 1/4" x 1/4". Would that be small enough even for the younger guys?


This is what most in the US use. Haven't read of any baby escapes from it, as long as the mesh is welded/galvanized. (Can't be pushed apart.)

Wheels: Wheel size, when I used upright wheels, 6-7 inch wide seemed to be best, but you might be able to get away with smaller, especially when younger. The size seemed to translate down a bit to flying saucers (medium)/fast tracs (only one size) as well, if you ever decide to use those. (I really LOVE the saucers, and so do the mice!) Some mice don't seem to need them, and get by fine with TP rolls, or just hay/bedding. Others seem to be bored out of their minds, and can't entertain themselves. Does, especially resting ones, or bucks. If you are keeping the mice where you could hear them in the late evening, I would advice breeding from mice that seem to be content without wheels, when possible. Alternatively, take the wheels out before you settle in for the evening. Or rotate some cages with a wheel, and half or so, who don't.

Careful with the second level idea, as it can cause air flow problems. Climbing/hanging things might work out better. Ropes are debated, but I think most agree that hemp and...something else, but not cotton, is safe. Mostly because mice shred such items, and can get threads wrapped around body parts in dangerous ways. I have stainless chains for the same idea, and string a few TP tubes, half a paper egg carton, etc., through them.

Those 'nesting boxes' look fine.  Don't be upset if they don't use them to sleep in, though. If you're in a cold/dry area they might love them. Or they might pull out all the tissue, make a nest elsewhere, and use the balls to play on. You might try hanging half of one, filled with tissue or shredded paper, from the ceiling.

One of the fastest, easiest 'toys' is a TP roll filled with hay and some of the fattier/flavorful parts of their diet. Then I wrap a piece of packing paper around it like a Christmas 'cracker' (amazon, etc, uses those for shipping). A single mouse with one of those can be occupied for a good while, even after they chew into it. It can be hung at each end from the ceiling too, making it more of an adventure. Just make sure the hanging parts go through the TP roll part, as the wrapped paper tends to get shredded.

Your bedding choices should work well for mice. I would add a strong recommend for alfalfa pellets on the bottom of every cage for odor. Or the timothy/alfalfa blend pellets, whichever is less costly, especially if both of you have no trouble with hay. (Feed stores carry these, for horses.)

No need for feeding bowls for sure, unless you feed them wet foods/treats. (Yogurt, soaked/sprouted grains and seeds, etc. ) I feed those, but I use 1 oz ramekins, or souffle containers to feed from. Just keep an eye on what they have in the bedding so you get to know about how often you should add more.

-Zanne


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