# Saving runts? Should "Premium Milk Replacer" do the trick?



## gyri (Nov 20, 2012)

One of my females gives birth to HUGE litters and about half the time every mouse survives to be a hopper. On two occasions in the past she's had 1 or 2 young that became real scrawny runts that I decided to feed off to one of my snakes rather than let them starve to death. I have a small syringe (without the needle) and a can of GNC Ultra Mega Premium Milk Replacer. My girlfriend got it from the animal shelter she works at and its first three ingredients, in order, are: Water, Goats Milk, Soybean Oil then a long list of nutrients, minerals, and dietary supplements. I've got 1 runt right now that I found outside of the nest today. I'd like to try and save it but is it worth my time? I think I'll try to leave it in the nest most of the time, maybe it can score some actual mouse milk, but is it worth my time to take it out a few times a day and see if I can get it to drink this stuff? Should it be warmed up?

Thanks.


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## Fantasia Mousery (Jul 16, 2011)

I'm a bit confused, so I'm sorry if I misunderstood something. But how many times have this doe had babies? Because it sounds like she's had quite a few litters, and in that case I wouldn't let her have more. I only let does have 2-3 litters (3 as absolute maximum). And if she has big litters, never more than two, even if I cull a lot of them. It's too stressful for her, and not healthy for her little body.

Anyway, about the runt! Personally, I would think it waste of time. It might sound harsh, but you will get much more out of the remaining litter if you don't waste the mom's efforts on a runt that might not even make it.


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## gyri (Nov 20, 2012)

I was thinking this might be her last batch (4th time). The first litter was small with only 4 young but the next two times she had 15 and this time it was down to 13 but one of the pinkies was smothered under the rest of the litter I think so she only nursed 12 after the first day. I'm pretty new at this and did not think 4 or 5 litters was unreasonable but perhaps I am wrong.

I'll decided to give this milk replacer a shot, most of the litter has open eyes and a couple have left the nest on their own. My guess is this runt could be a hopper within a couple days at which point it should be better off. If it looks to be gaining weight at the end of tomorrow I'll stick with it until its able to eat some solid food otherwise off it goes.

Thanks for your input.


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## Cordane (May 22, 2012)

Well I'm not going to go into what I disagree with in regards to how you go about breeding so moving on..
Personally I agree with Jathy, you won't be able to breed from this runt and if it was me, I would not feel comfortable adopting out a mouse that the Mum kicked out of the nest. In my opinion, Mum knows best and if she kicks one out then there is something wrong. Also, even though the mouse should be starting to eat solids a little after their eyes open, that does not mean that they do not require Mums milk any longer. The bub will still need feeding every 4-6 hours or so until it is 4 weeks old.

As for the milk replacer itself, I have always been told to never feed a mouse anything Soy as it is hard to digest but whether or not that is 100% true, I don't know, but I have heard it enough times from enough people to avoid it.


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## gyri (Nov 20, 2012)

I understand that breeding ethics are a subject of debate, no need getting into in too far but I would like to state that the main reason I started breeding was as a source of feeders. that being said, I am open to suggestions and I agree that a runt mouse should never be adopted out for sure but as a feeder I figured it was worth a shot to save it. The funny thing is that while my snakes were the reason I started doing this I am now more interested in the mice and do plan on adopting some out as soon as I am producing an excess.

In regard to soy, I saw in another thread someone was cautioning against it in another someone said its OK which left me a bit confused.


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## Cordane (May 22, 2012)

gyri said:


> I understand that breeding ethics are a subject of debate, no need getting into in too far but I would like to state that the main reason I started breeding was as a source of feeders. that being said, I am open to suggestions and I agree that a runt mouse should never be adopted out for sure but as a feeder I figured it was worth a shot to save it. The funny thing is that while my snakes were the reason I started doing this I am now more interested in the mice and do plan on adopting some out as soon as I am producing an excess.
> 
> In regard to soy, I saw in another thread someone was cautioning against it in another someone said its OK which left me a bit confused.


Feel free to ask as many questions as you like in regards to breeding.  
As for the soy, If i hear that something is bad from more than 5 people then I generally avoid it. Personal choice there.


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