# What can mimic the variagated pattern?



## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

I'll get some pics soon, but I wanted to throw this out here tonight. What kind of genetics can mimic the varigated pattern? For example, could a brindle or merle appear to be varigated? The reason I ask is because in one of my recent litters, there appears to be a varigated mouse! But both parents are solid colored, and not varigated. I know that varigated is a dominant gene, so it's impossible that the baby is varigated, and yet that's exactly what it looks like. The mother is a very brown looking dove that I bred myself, so I know it can't be from her. The male is from the store, and I believe he's some kind of c-dilute. I did have varigateds in my mousery before, about a year ago, but I bred out the gene. Is it possible for a c-dilute to hide the varigated pattern? Of the other babies in the litter, three are PEW, and two appear to be chocolate. I think the varigated one might be chocolate, but his markings are pretty diverse so it's hard to tell.

I'll try to get some pics in the next couple days. In the meanwhile, any thoughts???


----------



## Frizzle (Oct 6, 2011)

Someone had commented that my Charlies looked variegated, & with them both being located on the W locus, I would imagine that it would be feasible w/selective breeding.

http://www.fancymicebreeders.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=13503&p=119948&hilit=charlie#p119948

I imagine that a c-dilute like albino or ch could have hide the pattern, but I'm not sure which others would cover it up. Are there such things as over-marked variegated? Ones with so little pigment they appear solid?

I excitedly await a picture! Also maybe a picture of the parents?

Edit: I did have a couple highly pied roan-like merles that came out really sketchy. This is from the merle genes that act recessive, where you need two copies of the genes for it to show itself.










Edit #2: By happens chance, I stumbled on the Aussie forum coats & colors, & last page there is a pied roan/merle? that I would have thought was a vary.

[url=http://australianratforum.com...stralianratforum.com/forum/sho ... kies/page7


----------



## Dino (Apr 17, 2013)

Sometimes variegated is a weird gene. It is actually not entirely dominant, it can sometimes be carried, although that's uncommon.


----------



## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Any chance it's due to the splashed gene? I've had that kind of thing in tri litters.


----------



## Frizzle (Oct 6, 2011)

I was thinking about this. It's been mentioned to me that when banded is bred with pied, pied will sometimes retain aspects of banded, despite the gene not actually being present. Since variegated is on the same locus and was previously in the line, is there any pigment linkage?


----------



## madmouse (May 19, 2012)

Variegated is highly variable. Most of them will basically look like a banded with a head spot, with many speckles in the band. Other common patterns that pop up in my variegated are solid colored mice with a white stripe up the nose and white mice with just black speckles on the rump (a bit like an appaloosa horse).


----------



## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

I would guess that variegated is one of the more difficult types to perfect, just like uneven marked. Many kinds of markings can rest within a genotype and show up later. Anyone who has bred yellow brindled or umbrous will see all kinds of 'phantom' shadows of marking genes show, except for those who have spent a lot of time making sure they have meeces that don't produce banding or other kinds of things.

I suspect that there are a number of ways to get a mousie to look variegated, but still more ways of getting weird results.


----------



## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

moustress said:


> Any chance it's due to the splashed gene? I've had that kind of thing in tri litters.


I have splashed that look like variegated.


----------



## pauly (Feb 21, 2013)

Any chance you might have a pic of each ? They've always looked the same to me .


----------



## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

variegated


----------



## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

and this is splashed which I think looks variegated 'ish.Mainly because although splashed is colour on colour and variegated colour on white,a splashed with a very diluted body colour gives the illusion of colour on white.


----------



## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Yupper, I've got these as well; I had two of these show up in my latest blue tricolor litters.


----------



## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

I really enjoy the variable results,pretty.


----------



## pauly (Feb 21, 2013)

SarahC said:


> splashed is colour on colour and variegated colour on white


That explains it very well, thanks.


----------



## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Unfortunately, the mother of the litter died, and though I took a picture of the litter, ultimately I lost them all since I had no other litters to foster them on. I know the babies already look bad in these pics. It was a couple days after the mother had died. Since there were two sisters in the cage, I was hoping the auntie would help them along, but she didn't.

The baby from a couple different angles




The entire litter. There were a couple brownish ones that resembled the mother, and three PE that might have been PEW or a really light c-dilute of some sort.


The dad, named Sheldon after the Big Bang Theory. He's some kind of c-dilute, I'm thinking some kind of RY or chocolate, since he never throws agoutis or blacks even when bred to other chocolates. He's a fox as well. I got him from the pet store, so there's no telling what his genetics could be.


The auntie, who looks exactly like the mom. She looks chocolate in this pic, but her parents were blue based, so I think she's a really weird lilac (dove? I get the UK and US terms mixed up) color.


----------



## Miceandmore64 (Jul 16, 2013)

Any idea why she died? Im sorry for your loss that IS A beautiful mouse


----------



## Autumn2005 (Apr 21, 2010)

Not sure. She was on the older side, but her sister, who's the same age of course, is still alive. Maybe the stress of nursing the babies was too much for her, since it was the non-nursing doe that survived? I'm not going to try to breed the sister since she is old, but I still have the male, and he's been actively breeding other does. In a couple weeks I should get more of his babies.


----------



## Miceandmore64 (Jul 16, 2013)

How old was she?


----------

