# What the...........



## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Please could someone help.
I have a litter of babies, and among the expeced colours were these two :? 
Dad is agouti, mum is choc tan. 
The litter consists of
Agouti with light bellies
Black tan
and these two?

Anyone got an idea what they are? Thanks


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

They look like Argente's to me! (Pink eyed Agouti) I may be wrong though, keep an eye out for a blue undercolour.

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

They are just too cute, so that means both mum and dad must carry p?
By the way heres a pic of mum


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

Wow! Is mom Variegated?


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Apparantly, so i've been told. When she was little she looked like a regular choc tan with a little white triangle on her back. As she has molted more and more white hairs have come through :?


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

You know. . . There's a similar marking in horses. That appears over time and looks sort of like a webby pattern. Let me see if I can find you some information on that! It looks a lot like your mouse there.

She looks sort of variegated, but the markings are usually more blurry. . .


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

Here we go. It's called 'lacing'.

http://horseandman.com/_wp/wp-content/u ... lacing.jpg

http://horseandman.com/_wp/wp-content/u ... 00x199.jpg

http://www.horsegroomingsupplies.com/pi ... G_1199.jpg

I don't know if it's possible to have it on mice. But it tottally looks like that!


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

A couple of her babies have the little white triangle on their back like she did, i am hoping they will develop this pattern like their mum  As time goes on she seems to be getting more and more white hairs, at this rate she may end up as a BEW :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Wow!! I have never seen white marking change on a mouse before! Fasinating!

I learn something new everyday! lol If any of her babies do that, then it must be dominant.

And as far as I know, varigated mice are born with thier markings, they don't develop over time.

W xx


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

Did your mouse have any offspring with the same pattern? Or did her parents have that pattern?

You started this post about the babies, but we're all fascinated by mum! :lol:


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Really? Oh i just thought they developed over time. Seriously she stared bieng a solid choc tan with 1 white marking. We jokingly named her nappyhead coz it looked like she was wearing one :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I am actually so fasinated by this, I want to kidnapp some of the babies, and take pictures of thier development!


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Her mum is a right gentic mix up, here's a pic
















dad was a satin choc tan if i remember right


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

She was the only one of the litter that had this little triangle. All the others were tans and broken :?


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

And yes 2 of the babies also have her little white mark so i will be keeping an eye on them


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I want them... :shock:

hehe. Heather and Sarah would kill me... but seriously, I want them. lol

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Why will they kill you?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I'm supposed to be being good and concentrating on my show varieties lol

But genetics and unknown stuff like this fasinate me!!! I want them... hehehehee

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

What they don't know........  
Is this seriously some kind of unknown genetic thing?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Its definately unknown to me at least hehee

If this had occured to any of my mice, I would seriously be taking pictures like every week to document the change in markings and such.

If one of the babies is a buck, I may just have to come to your house and steal him!!! *shifty eyes*... ahem... I am joking of course! hehe

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Maybe i could start a stud service, like with my ferret!!!
Bring all your girls to recieve the wierd gene :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

:lol: :lol: :lol:


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

I thought all you genetic gurus had the answer for every kind of mutation, i mean that sincerely.
I am a newbie, I'm not equipped to deal with this so soon in my genetic journey. 
I feel stress now, what if something happens to the mutant gene carrier?  :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Give them to me... I will take care of them! hehee

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Well her mummy is in with a man at the mo so maybe she is the one who gave the gene to this mouse?
I thought white spotting was recessive? or am i brain fried?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

The 'spotting' gene (s/s) is recessive... but the 'lethal white' gene is dominant (W/w)

Its possible this is the W gene, or maybe a combo of both W and s/s with modifiers that are spreading the white.

Also, it could be some sort of gene that is 'switching off' the melanin in hair folicles, so when new hairs grows through molting the hair comes in white. Also if the pattern spread is affected by molting, then males with this gene/genes may not have as much markings as females, as females molt more.

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Wow, this is really fasinating. Is there any way to find out what this is?
If this was molt related then wouldn't the white hairs be allover?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Like I said, I have never seen this before... do you mind if I tkae the picture of the mum and show it to a friend of mine? He is alot more knowledgable about genetic modifiers than me, and he may have heard of this, or have a better theory than me...

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

No problems, I am as curious as you to find out what this is. If I can i will post pics of the other babies tommorrow so you can see what i mean about the marking. Wow I was fasinated by the 2 babies i posted, completely ignoring the wonder that is mummy...Duh me


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## ccoryjohnn (Jul 2, 2010)

Wow the mother is gorgeousss. Id love to have a pet mouse with her coloration


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Thankyou, i hadn't realised she was so different. I thought everyone had a blochy choc tan in their pet shop collecion


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## ccoryjohnn (Jul 2, 2010)

and yes, please post pictures of the babies!


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Will do x


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Fantastic and weird meeces you have there. The doe in particular is unlike anything I've ever seen. Her markings remind me of half melted snow on mud or soil. that makes it sound ugly, but she's anything but that! The black and white tan one is the grandma? She's a little odd as well; very very hairy little thing. I want to see the rest of the little ones! Please?

(Is there any chance there's a little bit of tri in the background?)

Oh, right you got them at a petshop; NVM.)


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Yep her mummy is a strange thing, the pics really are not very flattering :lol: The white hairs on her are long but all the rest are short!
I guess i am lucky to have kept her. I started breeding to feed my ever growing collection of reptiles and then i discovered show type mice  But there is a special place in my heart for pet type


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

We don't have the Splash gene over here Moustress, there cannot be tri in the background.

Cool, I will take the pic and show it to my friend Roland... Has the white continously developed? Is it still appearing?

W xx


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Isn't there a guy in Poland who breeds tris? tom, I think? maybe tom95?


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## Erica (Apr 18, 2010)

She is beautiful! She reminds me of a fallow deer or a whitetail deer fawn. I think we are all going to be wishing our chocolate tans turn into one like her. I know I am! :lol:


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## Lizzle (Apr 7, 2010)

> Yep her mummy is a strange thing, the pics really are not very flattering :lol: The white hairs on her are long but all the rest are short!


That's bizarre! :lol: In a good and interesting way of course! I would love to have your meeses. xD

How on earth does that work with the hairs, though? How are only the whites ones longer?


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

I have no idea how the hair ends up like that, maybe someone can help?
Well granny mouse had another litter about 4 weeks ago. They are all black and white and again on some of the babies the white patches have longer thair than the black :? 
I have no idea what causes it, if they were longhaired then wouldn't all their hair be long????


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## Lizzle (Apr 7, 2010)

> I have no idea what causes it, if they were longhaired then wouldn't all their hair be long????


I would think so! :lol:

I had a guinea pig years ago who had long hair only on his bum. What I find most interesting about your mice is that it seems the color of the hair determines the length -or vice versa. I've never, ever heard of that happening with any small mammals. Very cool!


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

I will put up pics tommorrow and then we can see what others think


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## Lizzle (Apr 7, 2010)

Please do! Would love to see!


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Yay pictures!!

I still want some of these magic mice.

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Sorry but they are only pet type, if only they were show............
But granny must have some strange genes because every litter she has had has had...oh go on one more for luck...has had some babies with this strange hair thing. All of her babies have been mmo moo mice but only some have long hair on the white patches and short on the black patches. All the other mice in the litter have short hair all over.........


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Have you had anymore mice with the spreading white hairs?


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## The Village Mousery (Aug 1, 2010)

yeah did the babys hair get whiter?


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

I have kept the babies with the white patches. I am keeping an eye on them. Mummy didn't start getting more white hair untill some time before 12 weeks so keep your fingers crossed. Every day I check to see if there are any more white hairs...I am soooo sad eh?


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

Once they hit the age that thier mum was when the white started spreading, take pictures every week... that way, even if it spreads only a little bit, you will be able to compare pictures!

W xx


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Just every week, or daily!!!! :lol: :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

LOL Daily is fine too!! hehe


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Actually I need to look at the pics of mummy again as I am thinking she is getting more white dots. She didn't have that many on her tummy and I am pretty sure she looks like there are more.....


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

This is so awesome. . . I love your little mutant mice! 

Havey ou looked into somatic mutations? It's possible that that is the cause, although I've never heard of them appearing more and more over time. . .


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

That went totally over my head  
Say what?


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## JustMouse (Jul 23, 2010)

i want more pictures! let's see how these pups are coming along!!


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

Here's some info on Somatic mutations:

http://www.ashgi.org/color/Aussie_somat ... tions.html

Somatic mutations can occur in many animals. 

http://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/glossary=somaticmutation


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## mousemad (Jun 7, 2010)

Oh ok..
Well I guess it all rests on her babies, if they develop spots or not!


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## Raindropmousery (Jan 10, 2010)

wow the first pic of the choc tan with loads of white splotches is soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo cute its amazing never seen one like it bet they would sell really well as they are soooooooo pretty.


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## Rhasputin (Feb 21, 2010)

Any updated pictures? Did the babies develop the spotting?


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## Stina (Sep 24, 2010)

inquiring minds would like to know! I would also breed a buck back to his mother...if you didn't get the "growing spots" this time around, you may get them by breeding back to mom, or at least between siblings.


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