# Does this hold true with mice?



## Paul Brockman (Jun 28, 2011)

As a recent convert to fancy mice I'm having to learn a whole new raft of terminology and gentical terms and values , I must say the mouse world has taken 'simple' genetics to a level that leaves a lot of the other fancies standing . The two main problems I face are : 1. Terminology ---right across the differing fancies in the UK ( and to further muddy the waters , the world ) will use different terms to describe the same thing . 2. Inheritance --I'm (very) slowly starting to get my head around this one.

So to my question which is about pied or piebald . Albanism is normally expressed by the red eye because the lack of melanin production allows the blood vessels to show through .Not all albanistic animals are white , the term 'ino' normally means albanism is present ,ie: Albino -white with red eye , Lutino --Yellow with red eye etc. A white animal with black eyes is , to my understaning , the result of Leucism , leucism can cause the reduction in all types of pigment. Partial Leucism results in patches of white on an otherwise normally coloured animal , known as pied or piebald . This is not just to the coat but actually in the skin. A true pied will have differing skin colour under the fur/hair -----does this hold true with mice ?

The skin of a black and white pied would have 'pinky' coloured skin under the white and 'blue/blackish' coloured skin under the black . I know there will be someone reading this going 'Doh' ---but I have never actually held a pied kit in my hand to study it , I need to discover if what I already know can be transferred to mice or if it is a complete new begining . I'm off work this week supposed to be doing the garden and 100 other 'little jobs' the wife has saved up for me ---instead I'm pooring over mouse genetics -----

Regards Paul.


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

Yep, you're absolutely right:










The very dark ones are black Dutch, the paler ones are chocolate Dutch


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## Anne (Mar 21, 2011)

yes their skin has the white spots (and my post was too slow I see  )


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## Paul Brockman (Jun 28, 2011)

Thank you both for supplying the pictures , its a great help and much appreciated . It would seem a little of the knowledge I have can be transferred when dealing with mice . I spent many years breeding 'ino's' , albeit the feathered kind , and one thing was that Vitamin A deficiancy had to dealt with. I would assume the same will hold true for Albino mice .

Never thought I'd say I'm glad its raining but at least I have an excuse why I haven't touched the garden 

Regards Paul.


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## jadeguppy (Jun 4, 2011)

Paul, send some of that rain my way. Have you seen the genetics and varieties listings on thefunmouse?


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## Paul Brockman (Jun 28, 2011)

I have now  As I say I've spent most of my adult life using the terminolgy of the bird world and we were a little spoilt on the subject of genetics because 'charts' had been produced that say (in lay mans terms ) 'If you cross this with that you will get -----and the expections , in general form , were given , So we knew what to do to get a desired result even if we didn't know how it 'worked' . I find the subject of genetics facinating but a little difficult to grasp , old dog , new tricks and all that , but I'll plug away until I get it into this thick old head of mine . 

Regards Paul.


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## Wight Isle Stud (May 19, 2010)

As an experienced breeder of livestock you already know that when one manufactures a breed through the use of genetics, there follows many years of selection to bring the breed up to show standard . Therfore standard advice is to get some in of your chosen breed, there will be 120 years of selection behind them. 
None of our mouse varieties need special diets, our reds/fawns are prone to putting on weight, a couple of sex linked genes but thats about it.
If I can guide you in your study, start with learning the effect of our main genes on other colours, for instance Pink Eyed Dilution dilutes black to grey, chocolate to champagne, agouti to argente, to name but a few, chinchilation, blue dilution etc. Brush up on how to combine known recessive genes onto one animal and your there. There however is no substitute for going to an established breeder and getting some proper stock. Regards Gary.


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## Wight Isle Stud (May 19, 2010)

just re- read your first post- to clarify , in the mouse fancy we have two genes that give rise to pink eyes, Albino, and pink eyed dilution, albinos are white fur obviously, where as pink eyed dilution mice can hav lots of diferent coat colours with pink eyes.


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## Paul Brockman (Jun 28, 2011)

Thanks for that Gary , sound advice and appreciated . You know the old saying 'learn to walk before you run' ---I'm at the crawling stage just thinking about standing up 

Regards Paul.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

this site may help you with the genetice, i found it fantastic when i started
http://www.hiiret.fi/eng/breeding/varieties/index.html
http://www.hiiret.fi/eng/breeding/genetics/index.html


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