# Red eyes +red eyes =black eyes?!



## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Jimmy Dean, a champagne buck and Aunt Jemima, a tricolor doe with red eyes, have a litter of eight lovely little squeakers...they are both red eyed...apparently one of them has eyes diluted by something other than the recessive p that we all associate with red eyes. Very weird? Any thoughts, anyone? Maybe c^h is responsible for her dilution? or c^e or both?

She was soooo big before she popped!

Here she is before delivery:


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## SiamMeece (Sep 21, 2010)

Your tricolor doe looks like himilayan (c^h/c) which would explain the red eyes (if she really is, I'm never sure with splashed and tricolor) so if she has two copies of c-dilutes and one or no copies of p-dilutes and your champagne buck has no or one copie of a c-dilute than black eyes are a possibility if the pup inherits one copie of a c-dilute and one or no copie of a p-dilute....mmm, reading this back I hope it makes sense :roll: 

Beautiful doe


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

What goes on when breeding tricolors is so frequently surprising and hard to explain. It'll be very interesting to see how this litter turns out. Thanks for your thoughts.


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## m137b (Sep 22, 2010)

It really isn't the 'tricolor' that is causing this, but the interaction of c-dilution[the tricolor doe] and p-dilution[the champange buck]. These two genes are located on the same chromosome and rarely cross over to result in a mouse that is both c and p diluted.

It's explained better here http://www.afrma.org/mk-linkage.htm


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## Roland (Aug 17, 2009)

m137b said:


> It really isn't the 'tricolor' that is causing this, but the interaction of c-dilution[the tricolor doe] and p-dilution[the champange buck]. These two genes are located on the same chromosome and rarely cross over to result in a mouse that is both c and p diluted.
> 
> It's explained better here http://www.afrma.org/mk-linkage.htm


Sorry, but the linkage between the p and the c-locus has nothing to do with the black eyes of the babies. The linkage just explains that it is difficult to get crossovers between p and c-loci and therefore it is difficult to get a c-diluted p-mouse. It is possible, a good example is Argente cream. 
What happened here is what Charles already described: a c-dilution caused the red eyes in the mother, while the red eyes of the father are from the p-locus. The cross of ch/c P/P x C/C p/p gives C/* P/p, which are black eyed, of course.

Regards, Roland
Chilloutarea Mousery - Tricolor , Splashed , Merle , Recessive Red


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Isn't that what m said! Kind of inside out, but that's what I got from his post....that this isn't bcuased by s rare linkage but by the tricolor dilution via the c^h giving me a himalayan tricolor, thus the pink eyes. His eyes= pp her eyes=c^h. Her= PP he=pp All babies=Pp. Right? I don't think he's claiming anything odd or unusual going on. I already had a clue, and he filled in the blanks.

You are so eager to bust someone's chops; lighten up Sunshine! 

I had suspected she might be c^h and now I know. Thanks to m and  to R.


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## Roland (Aug 17, 2009)

moustress said:


> lighten up Sunshine!


Me? No, thank you; not your sunshine Mousestress. Choose someone else :lol:


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

Yes, you are right. I avoid the sun as much as possible, as I know it is not my friend.


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## Laigaie (Mar 7, 2011)

Okay, I've now also had this problem. Unfortunately, it was between my dove tan female and my fawn male, so it's quite likely something going on with my fawn male. Both pink-eyed varieties, and producing only three out of nine babies pink-eyed! Some of the black-eyed babies even look like bews! Given that the doe shouldn't be carrying red, I assume these are just some very pale c/c^* pups. They were only just born yesterday (I think, been out of town for the long weekend), so I'll get pics as they color up. While it's good to know Yam's carrying something weird in the c-category, I'm a little disappointed to get so many white-looking babies out of a litter that was supposed to yield more tans! Perhaps they'll be foxes.


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