# Paralyzed hind legs? *Now with video!* -- Update 4.05.11



## Lizzle

I'm at a complete loss here, everyone. Please help my beautiful little Chex man. 

I had been away for two days before yesterday, and nothing was out of the ordinary with any of my mice. I came back yesterday to find my little Chex stuck upside down with his body twisted to one side. I picked him up, and his little face was as alert as ever and he didn't protest or act like he was in pain at all. He's since been dragging his little back legs behind him when he walks and the little back legs will suddenly twitch really fast for a moment every so often as he drags himself with his front legs to walk. He's been eating and drinking normally, and his poops are completely fine. I decided to change his litter and then put down only white tissues to see if he's peeing normally. Around his middle (intestinal region below lungs), he seems distended, but he does not act like he's in any pain at all even when I poke him there. He can't clean his underside so I have been cleaning it myself (when he pees, he pees on himself) and keeping the area as dry as possible to prevent skin irritation/breakdown.

Could he have suddenly become diabetic or something and is having neuropathy in his hind extremities..?

I don't know what's wrong, but I'm so worried.  I've never, ever seen this before. What's scaring me even more is that it appears it might be happening to one of his daughters who is in a cage on the other side of the apartment (could it be genetic?). His daughter's hind legs are noticably weaker and it seems like her bottom is flatter against the bottom of the cage, if that makes any sense.

Please help me!

**Now with video**
Click to watch it:

http://i619.photobucket.com/albums/tt272/lizashleyc/cam%20videos/th_Chex-Injury.jpg


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## Rhasputin

Does he have a wheel or any toys? It sounds like nerve damage to me.


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## Lizzle

He has no wheel, but he had a little cardboard box that he chewed holes in and seemed to get stuck in.. needless to say I removed the box, but it was still extremely strange because the little box was made out of a soft cardboard that was easily chew-through by mouse standards. I don't know if the paralysis occured before he got 'stuck' upside down or after. I was actually just about to PM you, Rhas. This is the little satin boy I got from you so I was wondering if you had seen this before?

I just want the little guy to be able to live a 'normal' life; I'm hoping that this isn't going to worsen like some sort of mouse ALS or something.


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## Rhasputin

Oh dear. No, I haven't seen anything like that in the line he came from. It's still going and all I've seen out of them is one mouse with a mammary tumor. 
There are tons of ways he could have hurt himself, even with no toys or furniture he could have done it somehow. Can he feel pain? Is his tail limp? Try pinching him on the tail, or on the back end, and seeing if he responds.


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## Lizzle

I actually just did, and although his tail is noticeably weaker, he still responded.

But in the last few minutes, Chex has very suddenly gone downhill.. his back is now all twisted and when I try to touch him below the head, he writhes in pain. He is keeping his bottom at a 90 degree angle from the rest of his body. I would take a picture but I can't find my camera charger. Anyway, he's now tachypneic on top of everything..

Edit: Although he is tachypneic, he is not using accessory muscles or hunched over. I'm 90% sure at this time that he is in end stage renal failure, but I'm baffled as to what may have caused this.. My poor little guy.

Edit again: Still tachypneic, and here's what else has become apparent: blotchy, pale, discolored tail and hind legs, as well as breathing that seems impaired on only one side (shallow and sow breathing compared to the other side). I'm glad that this is likely not genetic, and I think you're right in that he may have injured his spine somehow.. but I'm still confused as to why this suddenly seems to be getting worse so quickly. He's so thirsty and bloated, too.. that would also support end-stage renal failure, etc.


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## Rhasputin

Oh dear. . . What has he been eating?

I think you're going to have to put him down. .

I do hope he fathered some litters, his colours were really nice, and those two were so sweet!


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## Lizzle

He's been eating only kitten food, which is what I feed most of my mice (the non-obese ones xD).

His breathing is not as fast and shallow, suddenly, but yet another thing has become apparent - he has a big squishy lump on one side of his abdomen. Since it's squishy.. I'm guessing that it might be a hematoma, which could cause some rhabdomyelitis, which in turn can result in renal failure.. :|

I think I will have to put him down too.. it's just such a shame.  He did father a beautiful litter of satins, though, with the other gorgeous brindle and white lady from you!


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## Rhasputin

Poor thing. Maybe you need to be giving them a better diet. It's my understanding that the taurine it cat food isn't terribly good for mice. 
They probably should be getting a more varied diet. Don't know if that has anything do do with his condition though.


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## Lizzle

Oh I had no idea about the taurine. D: Generally I add seed mix to the kitten food and feed fresh veggies when I can, but he had gotten rather portly, so I stopped adding in the seeds and he appeared to be more healthy after I did that for awhile.

I once heard of a similar thing happening to a rat (somewhere online, I think!), and the rat magically got better after awhile.. though I doubt that's the case for Chex. It looks like all I can do is give him loves and watch him for now. <3


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## WillowDragon

You would have been better off taking out the kitten food rather than the seeds.

My mice never get veg... only the occasional few dandelion leaves from my garden. They dont really need veg, and too much can make them sick.


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## Lizzle

I tend to base the 'need' for veggies on their poops. I give them veggies about once a week or even less since I'm poor anyway. 

I'm curious as to why kitten food is so bad for them, though - I know I had read somewhere on a forum that it was the most wholesome or something like that. I'm going to go searching around the nutrition board now, I think. I feel so badly that I didn't know this..


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## Rhasputin

Yeah. You don't have many mice (I don't think, right?) so for you it might be easy to go to the grocery store and pick up things like pearled barley, quaker oats, brown rice, green or brown lentils, (small bag) holistic dog kibble and some millet seed from the pet store and make a small batch of feed for your critters.

I buy mine in 50lb bags and mix it all up. I also sell mine for $5 per gallon bag full, so maybe I could send some up if you're going to the next rodent fest?
Mine had oats, barley, safflower, sunflower, thistle, sweet feed, holistic dog kibble, white millet, pumpkin seeds, brown rice, green lentils. . . and god knows what else. It's a big variety since I have multiple species and they all have their preferences.


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## Cait

Liz, the reason that kitten food isn't used is because it's very high protein, and this can put a lot of strain on an animal's kidneys and cause problems. If you switch to a lower protein complete dog food that would be better, then just add some grains (oats and barley are the favourites) and some bird seed.


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## Lizzle

Oh wow, thank you both for that advice.  I feel so badly now.. I hope to god I haven't caused Chex's condition. I thought he was going down hill extremely quickly yesterday, but all of a sudden he's bounced back. His legs are still dragging and moving very slowly, and I made a little video. I will edit this once it's done uploading.


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## Cait

What you have described is not associated with kidney problems from what I have experienced. It does sound like either an injury or some sort of stroke type ailment. I don't think you could have prevented it so please don't blame yourself.


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## Lizzle

I agree with that, but yesterday I was convinced it was kidney issues for some reason. :? After watching my own video one time through, it looks very much like some kind of pelvic injury or something.. I mention in the video something about an 'abdominal issue,' but I don't know why it didn't dawn on me until now that it's probably SWELLING. I feel like facepalming a million times over.. big duh there. I definitely got my panties in a bunch so I wasn't thinking straight, I guess. He is one of my favorites after all.

I don't know how I could not look at him and immediately see a neuro/spinal issue. Well, I guess I could blame my lack of sleep? :roll:

If for some reason any of you can't see the video, please let me know and I'll change the file type. It should be about 4 minutes long, and is narrated by me.

Click on the picture to watch the video.


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## racingmouse

Just out of interest, I had a female mouse who I suspected had kidney problem at Christmas time. She was always a fat little mouse, but went from being fat, to very skinny in a matter of weeks. Her urine also went very dark and looked to have blood in it. She also started to take little `fits` near the end. I don`t know if this was due to the issues she had, or wether they were breathing related (she had been treated previously for bad breathing). Sadly, she took a final turn and passed away.

Kidney problems usually show the above sysmptoms like weight loss and darker urine, but the shortness of breath and looking as though they are taking little fits, i`m not sure about.

I don`t feed ANY animal proteins to my girls, with the exception of the odd crushed up dog biscuit, but I was guilty of feeding sunflower seeds as treats and these are high in fat, so lesson learned.

Paralysis in the legs seems more to do with nerve damage or toxins? Corn/maize can harbour toxins but I would imagine that would effect all the mice and not just one.


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## Kallan

That's a paresis, or weakness - in true paralysis he wouldn't have any motor control of his limbs. Hard to tell without doing tests to test his reflexes and other limbs/eyes etc but possibly a spinal injury/disc issue putting pressure on the spinal cord. From what I see the forelimbs appear to be working correctly - that would put the damage below the shoulder blades.

For these kind injuries in dogs and cats, we give them several weeks and if they're going to improve you will see them improving slightly usually after a few days. Can take up to 6 weeks to fully recover and may never get the same use of the legs back again. Sometimes steroids can help - lots of vets give them as they used to be the mainstay of neuro treatment. Though the evidence is lacking that they actually do any good they won't do any harm either.

If it was a metabolic problem or generalised neuropathy I would expect to see all four limbs affected to some degree.

Sorry for abrupt post, just in from work and very hungry!


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## Lizzle

Racingmouse, I thought that even mice needed protein, as they are omnivors, correct?

I used to feed my mice flax seed, rolled oats, and barley mixed together from the grocery store (I'd mix it myself). It got very expensive and then I was talking to a Petco employee who was the one who told me that kitten food was 'ideal.' I get my water bottles and wheels from Petco, never animals, but there you have more reason NOT to even take advice from them..

Kallan, this gives me hope! The injury site is definitely in the lower back, as it is the bottom of the spine that does not appear to even move (has a flat appearance). I'm keeping a close eye on him and will update with any changes. Thanks so much for clarifying things! You are an awesome asset to this forum.


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## racingmouse

Mice get proteins from the amino acids in the grains they eat, but sometimes these are not enough, so adding in some dog kibble or another source of animal protein is a good idea. I just don`t feel feeding too much of these kibbles is really necessary and they can be high in fat and salt and not all dog kibbles are suitable so you have to be careful to choose one that is a senior light variety with low fat. Many dog kibbles are actually vegetable based and manufactured by a process that adds in flavours or the dogs would`nt touch it!

The famouse rat `Shunamite` diet introduced adding dog kibble to a rats` diet, but kibble should only be added in small amounts and only if you are not using a commercial rat/mouse mix that does`nt already include animal proteins. Otherwise, kibble is`nt necessary.

Back on topic though and I hope you mouse gains some strength back. Rats can suffer from hind leg paralysis in old age, but you adjust their cage to one level and have food and water low down so that the mouse can access them easily and make sure they are not wetting themselves and causing a urine burn under their tummy.


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## SarahC

I got up a few weeks ago and found my dog in exactly the same state as your mouse and was referred to a specialist neurological vet.An mri scan and xrays are the only way to know,not really practical for a mouse but I'll pass on the specialists prognosis on examination prior to xray and scan.There are 3 possibilities.Injury to the spine which causes bleeding and where the blood pools it presses on the spine causing paralysis.Disc/ vertabrae damage either breed related or due to damage or lastly a tumour.Diet was not on the list of possible causes.The first option can't be treated,restrict the animal and provide as much rest as possible and in the case of a dog physio therapy,the second requires an operation to remove the matter which is interfering with the spine and the last has a very poor out look.My dog had the first scenario and it took 3 weeks to get back on her feet and 6 to get decent mobility.She has been left with a peg leg and has had to alter her gait to compensate.We'll never now how she injured her spine,we literally went to bed and all was well,got up and disaster had struck.If it is an injury,allowing the animal to drag it's back end around won't help and you should try confining it to a small area for a few weeks and see what happens.My vet offered euthanasia as an option which you might want to consider.I declined on behalf of my dog.


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## geordiesmice

The same happened to My friends dog SarahC it skidded on the polished floor in the house splayed its legs and hurt its back lots of rest like you said but shes very slow a Spaniel.


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## zany_toon

My mouse Scramble ended up like that back in September - he was running aorund one day and the next day he couldn't move his back end at all. One of Kallan's colleagues prescribed some anti-inflammatories which helped. Although he has never regained full use of his back legs, he is still here and happily running around (well he does the best he can) on a cage that is all on one level. He also still has use of a wheel in the form of a silent spinner which seems to make him very happy! I've added a video of him from a few weeks ago to show how he improved from the state your mouse was in (he was in the same condition, I didn't take a video of it though because with him being a pet I didn't want to think of him in that state  )


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## Lizzle

Thank you all for your input! Sarah - I never knew any of that. I have thought about euthanasia, but my Chex does appear to be in any pain (he might still be, but either way, it is not debilitating or showing at all).

Zany_toon - Thank you so much for sharing that! That makes me so happy to see.  Even handicapped mice can still lead happy lives. :lol: Chex has been in a one story cage this whole time, but now I use extra soft bedding (Kaytee Cozy Comfort), which isn't dusty at all and doesn't irritate his draggy little bottom.

Chex's back has straightened slightly and there appears to be less swelling around his abdomen. He has not regained use of his legs - they are still the same as they were days ago. However, he's still eating and drinking, bright eyed and appears happy.

*BUT: *There is really one kind of major issue he is experiencing, though..

Hi little mouse johnson / wang / tiny penis keeps getting stuck in an erection. :? He can't bend downwards to clean it himself or put it back in place, so every day I take him out to check it. If he has a little mouse-hardon going, I wet a tissue with cold water and give it a gentle wipe, and it usually goes down. There was one time I had to use my fingers to gently pull up the foreskin around it, and Chex bit me for the first time in his life - I almost dropped him from pain and was bleeding for what seemed like a long time. He seriously bit a chunk of my finger right off. My poor little man..

I guess he doesn't like the interspecies.. um, handjobs. :lol: :roll:


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## racingmouse

Can he retract his penis fully or does it stay out constantly? You can use a little bit of KY jelly (this is a clear jelly) found in any pharmacy, sometimes supermarkets. It helps to soften the area. Sometimes males get this due to forming a penis `plug` from what is understood to be semen. This harden like a rock and stops the male from urinating, so a urinary tract infection can happen as a result. So make sure he can pass urine freely and he`s not in any discomfort. he will probably lean over a lot to clean or pull at it, so keep close eye on him incase he self mutilates.


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## zany_toon

Lizzle said:


> Zany_toon - Thank you so much for sharing that! That makes me so happy to see.  Even handicapped mice can still lead happy lives. :lol: Chex has been in a one story cage this whole time, but now I use extra soft bedding (Kaytee Cozy Comfort), which isn't dusty at all and doesn't irritate his draggy little bottom.


Glad it made you happy  It certainly shows that a disabled mouse can be happy too - Scramble has been like that since September and is managing great although he does need help getting his ears cleaned (he loves getting them scratched and his cheeks rubbed :lol

Is it possible that Chex is suffering from a prolapse? I remember that when i posted about Scramble back in September that someone told me to keep an eye out for prolapse as it can lead to infection. If I remember correctly it's to do with the fact that the nerves may have been damaged in some way so the mouse has no control. A little KY jelly or a tiny amount of vegetable oil on a cotton bud/Q-tip rubbed into it and the surrounding area can help (Scramble had the same thing happen once or twice in the first couple of weeks of losing the ability to move his back legs and not since then.) I hope that Chex has many happy months ahead of him


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## Rhasputin

Does he seem to be improving at all?


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