# From Tan to Self (Silver)



## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

Okay. I really want to understand the genetics of mice, but I seem to be broken.  Therefore, please be patient with my silly questions. First, I have two silver tan bucks whose color I really love, and I was wondering how to breed out the tan.

The culprits:








Cloque









Chintz, Cloque's sire.

Secondly, how does one darken up the points in a Himalayan line? I'm in the process of proving out whether my girls are Siamese or Himalayan.

I don't doubt I'll have more questions in the future. :roll:


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

If your tans have 1 at gene then when they could produce selfs, but if they have 2 at genes then they will produse all tans. Your could test breed them to a self to see if they have 1 or 2 copies, if they have 2 they will produce all tans. If they do both have 2 you would need to put them to something that isnt tan and work with their tan babies who will only have 1 at gene.

with siamses you put them to a balck to darken the points, so i would asume it would work the same for himmi.


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## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

PPVallhunds said:


> If your tans have 1 at gene then when they could produce selfs, but if they have 2 at genes then they will produse all tans. Your could test breed them to a self to see if they have 1 or 2 copies, if they have 2 they will produce all tans. If they do both have 2 you would need to put them to something that isnt tan and work with their tan babies who will only have 1 at gene.
> 
> with siamses you put them to a balck to darken the points, so i would asume it would work the same for himmi.


I know Chintz was paired with a chocolate self and produced (as far as I could tell from the breeder's pictures) all black tans, but with his most recent pairing with the same girl there's one PE baby. I can't wait till they fur up. Thanks, I'll get to work on that.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

soundz like Chintz could be at/at then if her produced all tans when put to a self.

what colour is Cloque mother?


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## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

PPVallhunds said:


> soundz like Chintz could be at/at then if her produced all tans when put to a self.
> 
> what colour is Cloque mother?


She's a Siamese, she also produced three RY babies in the same litter.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

aha! so Cloque should be at/a so breed him to a self and you should have a 50%chance of getting self. He will also carry ch, and could poss carry ressive yellow then if mum produced it.

Ive read silver is genetical pinkeye blue, so what colour females do you have to breed him two?


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## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

Let's see..the ones not paired already are two PEW (SH and angora), the two RY angora, there's another Siamese that produced a blue boy so she's D/d..unfortunately she's with a boy already! I also have a pied dove and the self chocolate girl (currently kindling).

I think my future goals will be satin silver self and satin blue self.


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## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

Oh, also, that was my other question you answered.  I was wondering if my Siamese who is proved to be a/a B/* c^h/c^h D/d E/e go/go P/* (that's a mouthful, does it look right?) would pass on the recessive yellow to her son. It's kind of like a possible het for snakes.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

i dont know the gnentis for ressive yellow but if she carrys it (which she must if she produced ti) there would be a 50/50 chance her sone got a copy.

you could try the pew but you wont know what to expect unless you know the genes she has under that white. Id personaly use the siamese, with her you should get
Tan in black and blue
self in balck and blue
siamese in seal and blue
All pups will carry pinkeyes, but if the doe also carries it you will also get pinkeye diultes dove and silver.
Then keep a doe and buck self, pref blue but a black will do as it will carry blue. and bred tougher and you should get
self in blue and silver, (and black and dove if using a black)
siamese in blue (and seal if using a black)
you could also get another ressive pop up that you didnt know they carryed eg pied.

Or you could put Cloque back to his mother and you should get
siamese in seal and blue
tan in black, blue, silver, dove
self in black, blue, sivler, dove
as mum must carry a pinkeye gene.

if you dont want to inbreed you could also breed him to the blue pied asuming she has no c dilutes or pinkeye you should get
tan in blue
self in blue
all babies will carry pinkeye and pied.
Keep a blue self to breed to the blue self pup you got form breeding him to the siam and breed them tougher. you should get (asumin the blue pied didnt carry and c dilutes and the siamese didnt carry any pied)
self in blue and silver. 
Some pups will carry siamese and some will carry pied, and some will cally both and some will cary neigher.


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## thewesterngate (May 22, 2012)

Genetics are so fun, haha. Cool deal, I'll write up a little plan for myself and then find out how to squeeze satin into it now that I know two more are carriers (surprise satin babies in my pied litter!)


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