# Need help on breeds



## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

Hi, I am only new to the breeding project and have some very 'pretty' mice that I am about to breed together. But first I would like to make sure of the type of breed they are. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## minibears (Jul 30, 2010)

hi, u have beautiful mice, i assume you would like to know their colours and fur types, it would help to know what country you're in as it can differ.


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

Hi Minibears....I live in australia...and yes any help on the proper colouring and fur types would be greatly appreciated...


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## minibears (Jul 30, 2010)

i'm in aus too!
1: longhair rex manx, assuming pink eyed white? (PEW)
2: short hair rex manx, chocolate broken marked (piebald)
3: cant quite see, assuming standard chocolate?
4: " " ,standard black
5:assuming long hair blue mock chocolate
6:short haired rex, dove broken marked
7: possibly an argente cream or pinkeyed straw (is he yellowish?), in long haired rex
8: black shorthaired rex
9:dove, long haired rex
10: long haired black eyed cream
11 and 12: if they're not black they're havana(colour of black coffee) standard coat manx
don't quote me on any of these, pics are hard to genotype. uve got a huge amount of diversity there, what are ure goals? 
for references and personal interest try
https://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=dczmx ... rgdp&pli=1
and my favourite
http://www.hiiret.fi/eng/breeding/varieties/index.html


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

Hi Minibears,
Yes we are north of brisbane on bribie island...the two standard choc/black are carriers of manx and hairless so we will breed them and try and get some hairless mice if not a hairless manx. Have yet to see a hairless manx and not even sure if there are any out there. Would love to get some tri in the rex as I've only seen them in solid colours. Would eventually like to get something phenomenal and put in the brisbane show etc...
And yes #7 is a gorgeous light caramel/cream colour with pink eyes....


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## minibears (Jul 30, 2010)

be careful with hairless manx, they're not real tough. i'm breeding for size and type atm, hoping to improve the overall form of fancy mice in Aus. as u will know our pet stock and show stock are 1 and the same. i'm not sure we have tri in aus. i am in the eastern outskirts of melbourne, Iced is australian and very good with mouse genetics, she has also shown mice, it would be worth speaking with her. good luck


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## Anubis (Dec 19, 2010)

beautiful mice  
i have mice nearly identical to 2, 5 and 9


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

thankyou...i am just loving what we have...i have to say my favourites are the rex....so cute and fluffy....
am taking so much in at the moment that it's getting rather confusing on what is what etc lol..long hair, angora, rex, texel lol...so many names...wish it was as easy as saying black mouse, white mouse hahaha


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

Is it possible that my big boy in pic 6 is a reverse rumpwhite?....cause he looks like he has a pair of lilac pants on :lol: :lol:


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## SevenlevelsofDante (Nov 13, 2010)

You have beautiful mice!


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## JustMouse (Jul 23, 2010)

Gosh those are all gorgeous! I'm jealous! I want texel sooo badly!


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## kates (Jan 3, 2011)

Wow your meeces are lovely, I especially like 1 and 7 the longhaired rex's, so curly and their fur looks very dense and thick. Very nice


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

if you lived nearby JustMouse I would gladly give you one of our gorgeous texel's.....
the fur on our long haired rex's are indeed very thick...and they are all so very placid animals...they just hop on your hand for snuggles all the time....


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## FeralWolf (Dec 28, 2010)

I love your meeces!


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## icedmice (Oct 4, 2009)

minibears said:


> be careful with hairless manx, they're not real tough. i'm breeding for size and type atm, hoping to improve the overall form of fancy mice in Aus. as u will know our pet stock and show stock are 1 and the same. i'm not sure we have tri in aus. i am in the eastern outskirts of melbourne, Iced is australian and very good with mouse genetics, she has also shown mice, it would be worth speaking with her. good luck


Cheers, but I'm still learning genetics too.
I'm not great with guessing unstandardised colours, I've seen many that are never what they appear. Looks like you have a good mix.

You've got a great foundation there!
The "texels" aka.longcoat rexes look like they are still in juvenile coat. They might loose that desnity and length a bit as they mature, especially the girls.

There was someone trying to breed hairless manx a while back I think they wanted to call them "scrotums".

Great to see another Aussie fancier!
All the best with the outcomes of your pairings  .


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

*icedmice*
hahahaha scrotums.....great humour...
we have a gorgeous fawn long haired rex...his coat is so thick he is a little fluff ball...well big one actually...

Both of my rex girls have had litters and not one manx so i'm assuming that they have a weak manx gene....do i inbreed to make the gene stronger? i am so lost when it comes to this kind of thing so any advice would be greatly appreciated...


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## icedmice (Oct 4, 2009)

Manx in Australia is recessive to tailed. You possibly paired a mouse that didn't carry manx or were just really unlucky and didn't get a manx.
If one parent was manx than all the offspring are carriers.

To get a manx the perfered pairings are manx or manx carrier x manx carrier. 
It's not common practice to cross manx to manx because of the possibility it may excessivley shorten the spine. It has been done, and sucessfully, but it has a higher than normal risk of complication.


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## minibears (Jul 30, 2010)

i breed manx to manx for manx, i'm now in the process of breeding it out. manx is one of the fastest improved traits in aus mice. from 1 male carrier i achieved a complete lack of marks/bald spots, let alone stubs in 3 generations. two father daughter matings (mums were tailled sisters, also carriers inherited from dad), and the best pair from the two litters produced the best manx i have ever seen. to get frequency of good manx in litters it is necessary to back breed. carriers can be used with good manx without too much harm to the tail/lack of tail quality but frequency is lowered. whatever u choose to do with manx be considerate of the animals. the only prob i have ever encountered is the somewhat slower passing of faeces, they seem to hang there for just a little longer. my assumption is muscle wastage from lack of tail activity. manx are beautiful and popular because they're still seen as relatively unusual, have fun


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

thankyou so much minibears and icedmice....you've both certainly expanded my knowledge on manx that's for sure....
Both my rex manx girls have had litters...so I may take the best from both and breed them and see how we go there....


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## minibears (Jul 30, 2010)

if u back breed a boy bub from these manx mums with a manx girl(even their own mothers), 1/2 bubs will be manx, likewise if u breed a girl from these manx mums to a manx male 1/2 will be manx. if you breed the bubs to each other 1/4 will be manx. hope that isn't too confusing :-?


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## icedmice (Oct 4, 2009)

I recall being told at a show that a rex manx I had there would be unable to birth because of a curvature of the tail stub. The tail stub curled way below the hip. Funnily enough that very same doe that was critisesed produced the first grand champion from our mousery!

Moral of the story, go with your instinct.

I'm not going to tell you there is no risk breeding manx to manx, nor will I tell you they will all be hideously deformed. Truth be told I've never personally mated a manx to manx so I can't tell you from experience, there are many cases where pure manx matings have produced entire litters of healthy pups and the odd (rare) case where one or two pups have suffered reduced funtioning of the hind limbs from excessive spinal shortening.

Personally I'm investigating breeding manx rats however my buck has only produced a single litter after a 2 month period of living with the doe and is currently unable to get a second doe pregnant so there may be fertility issues with manx rats. I know I may hit hurdles in my project but it's something I'm willing to work on because I believe it's worthwhile to have variety in the fancy.


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## VanLea (Jan 30, 2011)

Funny you should say that icedmice....I have a texel caramel manx male who is also a p/e....he has been with his mate now for a month and still there is nothing...not that I haven't been perving on the odd occassion to make sure he is isn't 'gay' :lol: not that there's anything wrong with it....he does perform...maybe he is shooting blanks.....not sure....

but from my first litter I have got a beautiful little manx male who I shall put with one of the girls who carry the manx gene from my second litter and we shall see where we go from there.....

I do believe it is hit and miss and there will be more misses than hits....but the more knowledge i learn from you all the better understanding I will have with the 'breeding'....


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