# Blackthorn Mice at Home



## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

Took some pictures of the mice after cleanout this weekend and thought I'd share:

Young does in the big running on cages:






















































Dutch dam with litter and marten sable fosters:


















Young bucks running on:









And an extremely little blue buck. The picture is rubbish but so cute I thought it was probably still worth posting 









Blackthorn Stud and Whizzer, my beagle helper. He loves to watch me clean out :love1


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I am hypnotised by the ears on that black fox in the forth picture down...


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

Heehee, they're like radar dishes! "You will do my bidding and bring me mealworms!"

BTW, love the avatar Willow :lol:


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## WillowDragon (Jan 7, 2009)

I had to keep such fabulous artwork  

And you know... I do really like Blues. Such a beautiful colour. Maybe i should have a proper go of them one day... in the far far future.


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

I was similarly transfixed by the ears on that fox. I love seeing these naturalistic pix instead of just the posed photos. I find mousie behavior is endlessly fascinating.

It's interesting to see those nursing babies; so young with such big ears. Yikes!


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## love2read (Aug 30, 2011)

Eep! I want all of your blue bucks! They're so big! :mrgreen: I think I need to take a vacation to the UK. *dreamy sigh*


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## GypsyTails (Jul 14, 2010)

I love the photo of the "extremely little" Blue buck! He looks like he's singing. Little mousey crooner! <3


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## Tikmio (Oct 9, 2011)

moustress said:


> I was similarly transfixed by the ears on that fox. I love seeing these naturalistic pix instead of just the posed photos. I find mousie behavior is endlessly fascinating.


I agree... Sometimes there just to darn cute, it's nice to sit and watch them.


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## Serena (Dec 29, 2011)

The black fox is to die for. Such a cutie :love 
I love your tank setup. It's so neat and tidy. 
If you don't mind me asking: how big are those cages, and how many mice do you keep in each size?


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## Emfa Mouse (Dec 14, 2011)

I love your blues! So pretty!


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

> If you don't mind me asking: how big are those cages, and how many mice do you keep in each size?


On the top of the bench are the cages for running on large groups of does, these are 60cm x 40cm. Sometimes I keep up to 20 does in these but usually there's around 12. On the top shelf of the bench are the cages are for breeding bucks, these are 40 x 29cm and I'll keep one buck and two or three does in each one. The middle shelf is for nursing does with litters aged between two and five weeks. I have two litters to a cage (two does and 8-10 kitts). The bottom shelf is for does with young litters aged from newborn to two weeks. I keep one doe per cage and they are 45cm x 15cm. The marten sables/foxes cages are on the left and Dutch cages are on the right


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## Serena (Dec 29, 2011)

Thanks for your answer. 
It's always good to see/read how others keep their mice and use it as some sort of guideline.
And since you have gorgeous and obviously healthy mice, it seems to be a good way to keep them


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

Loverly! Also love those ears on the fox. I see the chin has found a firend


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

> I see the chin has found a firend


Yes - you know I put the chin in a Maxey with a black fox that I'd shown? That's the same fox as in the picture, the pair are completely inseperable! They'll both be going into a breeding cage with a black fox buck this weekend


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## DeepBlueC (Feb 9, 2012)

pic number 6 is a little beauty ............ :love1


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## Velvet_Meece (Apr 20, 2009)

your so lucky you can use hay as bedding!!!


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## Gill (Sep 16, 2011)

:thx I found it really useful to read the dimensions and the numbers you keep per cage. Due to the large number of unplanned pregnancies resulting from the antics of the Houdini hermaphrodite, I was very worried that I had too many mice in each cage (I had only seen recommendations for pets, not breeding stock). Using your figures, it would appear that I got it right. Many thanks.


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

I'm glad that helped you Gill  Mice don't mind being crowded at all (within reason!), more mice just means you have to clean out more often. If there's 20 in a running-on cage, I clean three times a week instead of twice, but there's no difference in the wellbeing of the mice. They just pile up together regardless


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## Gill (Sep 16, 2011)

Funnily enough, I'd noticed the piles! And I've been good and cleaned at least every three days - it saves my nose being offended. Judging by their activities, the mice themselves seem much happier in what I originally thought were overcrowded conditions.


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

What's important about the space one keeps mousies in is cleanliness, which includes good ventilation of both the tanks and the room the tanks are in. I've found that when I have just two or three meeces in a big tank they spend most of their time in one corner looking a bit put off; either that or they build a nice big nest with high sides and stay in that except when I bring on the food.


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

> Judging by their activities, the mice themselves seem much happier in what I originally thought were overcrowded conditions.


Yes, from what I have observed from all of my mice, they are definitely happiest in a group of at least five in a smaller cage where they feel safe. I know there are plenty of people who'd disagree with me but I kept pet mice for a long time before I started breeding and I'd keep a pair or trio of does in a much larger enclosure than mine have now. I can honestly say that the mice I have now are happier.


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## Serena (Dec 29, 2011)

Sarah, I know some people, who'd want your head for such a statement :lol: For some of them, space seems to be everything. (the largest minimum dimensions I found were 100*50*80cm for a small group of does (4 or 5 or sth like that) :shock: )
I find it really reassuring, to read experiences like your's, Gill's and moustress'.


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## tinyhartmouseries (Dec 30, 2010)

They are just darling, the dutches look so well marked!


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## maddeh (Jul 14, 2011)

I used to keep a trio of girls in my large glass tank with 3 shelves (which I was told I could house 3-4 rats in, though this I doubt), and the girls I have in there now seem much happier with their group of twice the size  I will keep adding to the group (to an extent) and just decrease the times between cleaning as it is great to see them so much happier.


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## Kingnoel (Apr 23, 2011)

Sarah, can I ask, how long are you able to run the bucks together before problems arise?

And also, what tricks do you use when you introduce girls to your run on tanks? I tried adding a girl to an existing colony and they were very rough with her till I had to remove her. She's now by herself and not happy! Will cleaning the tank good and reintroducing everyone at once help? Thanks, I too LOVE that silver fox, his ears are fine :lol:


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## SarahY (Nov 6, 2008)

> Sarah, I know some people, who'd want your head for such a statement


Yeah I know! :lol:



> Sarah, can I ask, how long are you able to run the bucks together before problems arise?


Urm, probably until about 10 weeks. If it's a buck I'd like to show I take him out much sooner (at about 8 weeks) because I don't want to run the risk of ear chips, which will end a showing career before it's begun. By 10 weeks though they've grown up enough that I feel confident to take out the best ones and keep them for breeding, then I don't keep the rest of them.



> And also, what tricks do you use when you introduce girls to your run on tanks?


I do it at clean-out time and just put the newbies in with the existing ones. My mice are used to new mice and mice leaving their cage for breeding, it happens every weekend so they aren't really bothered. On the rare occasions there is bullying going on, I just throw in a handful of mealworms and that completely distracts them


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## moustress (Sep 25, 2009)

The boys I have bunking together never get the whole cage cleaned at one time, as the lack of smell triggers territorial instincts. It smells like unclaimed territory, and that makes them fight. I always save about half of the bedding and mix it with the new. I try to get the stuff that's a little less dirty to mix back in.

As far as adding new mousies to a group, or mixing populations, I always give a good opportunity for them to get to know one another, but the scent is the key. When I have two groups of does that I'm going to combine, I switch the groups into the cage of the other, and then combine them along with the litter, half from each tank into the one in which they are going to live. then I throw a 'mixer', with treats for all. It works pretty well.

I used to have a big wire cage, and the meeces I kept in that always looked a bit nervous and dodgy. Your set-up with the wire enclosure inside the bin looks like a good compromise. I like the idea of the extra ventilation allowed by this type of cage.


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## Kingnoel (Apr 23, 2011)

Thanks all, great tips. Can't wait to give it a try.


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