# Show haul



## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

Well I finally have my long awaited mice from the show to complete the genes I wanted to get hold of and a couple of bonus things that were offered to me as a thank you and I couldn't resist!

Added to my mousery:
3 x-brindle does
Here are two of them, and the third is a younger black so a bit more marked than the one here at the moment









2 sepia (a buck and a doe) really nice personality young mice to pair with my siamese to get my started on blue burmese

1 siamese with nice and dark points to try to restart my siamese texels so I know they don't have c floating around

1 splash doe and buck that are not showing good contrast but have the ears and body type that I need to mix with my nice contrast but more pet type mice 
The buck when he was a little younger









Also a really nice black and a really nice blue doe to help with splash and blue burmese respectively as well as x-brindle.

Then on the way home drop of mice and pick up my final ones
Two of these:









They're young tiny things but I said yes when they were offered because they were the first mice that my guy had really seemed interested in and found really cute and it was just one doe so could have as a pet with my non breeders.... but ended up getting given two hairless does and a carrier buck.... they are just so strange though, I don't know what is is about them but I can't help but smile when I see them in all their ugly/cuteness. They are not the dominant gene the UK guys have so their body is all pink, but having that with the dark tail/feet/ears looks so funny!


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## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

lovely lot of mice.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

Thanks Sarah 

I'm so happy with them, starting out and just getting my second generation in the nest now so fairly new at this but can already see the progress and with these new ones now I am so excited for the next few generations.

and.... the hairless was meant to just be a "well I guess my guy finds her cute so one doe to live with my pets won't hurt" but we are both completely in love.... I can't really explain it but I can't help but smile at them lol


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## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

I love the hairless to,always have half a dozen or so for the cute factor.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

I wish we had the dominant gene you guys do over there. Being able to have skin pigment without compromising the hairless-ness would be amazing


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

SarahC said:


> I love the hairless to,always have half a dozen or so for the cute factor.


Do you ever find their nails an issue? Read some people say you have to clip them, other say you don't bother.

The thought of trying to clip a mouses nails is intimidating and they just seem so much more fragile too!

I was hoping that putting things like the bird perches that help with like budgie nails or the lava rock ledges you can get for chins might help but not sure if that would hurt their sensitive feed/skin.


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## Torin (May 18, 2016)

Your new mice look lovely. What's a sepia mouse? - I don't think I've heard of them, do you have a photo of those too?



Lilly said:


> I was hoping that putting things like the bird perches that help with like budgie nails or the lava rock ledges you can get for chins might help but not sure if that would hurt their sensitive feed/skin.


Lava ledges and other brands of perches made from pumice are excellent, and concrete bird perches while unsuitable for birds are relatively good as well (and cheap). This is especially true if you take care when placing them to put them somewhere which is much-used as a route throughout the day. The perches with a sand coating are less good for rodent feet in my experience. I use environmental things like this for keeping nails trim in exotic mice species, dwarf hamsters, and gerbils.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

Sepia is just the name given to a/a cch/chh mice over here, I guess could also call it mock chocolate but sepia is usually black with a redy-brown tinge to the fur from the cch.

I don't think anyone breeds them or that they have any standards, although the ones I got were bred purposely for myself and another breeder, they are usually just the result that people who breed fox get when they have a at/a x at/a pairing.

I will be breeding with siamese to get a whole litter of burmese because I couldn't get hold of any burmese and siamese x sepia gives 100% burmese where'as siamese x burmese only gives 50%.

That is interesting about the sand perches, those are the ones I was thinking of over concrete but will look out for the concrete ones now


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## Torin (May 18, 2016)

Lilly said:


> Sepia is just the name given to a/a cch/chh mice over here, I guess could also call it mock chocolate but sepia is usually black with a redy-brown tinge to the fur from the cch.
> 
> I don't think anyone breeds them or that they have any standards, although the ones I got were bred purposely for myself and another breeder, they are usually just the result that people who breed fox get when they have a at/a x at/a pairing.


Thank you very much for this info. I'd just asked out of curiosity, but it turns out that I have probably just made one myself. She's sort of bad black charcoal coloured, but there's black half-sisters to compare to which emphasises the difference. Also the breeder that the parents are from started that line by crossing marked to silver agouti, so it could viably have been carried 



Lilly said:


> That is interesting about the sand perches, those are the ones I was thinking of over concrete but will look out for the concrete ones now


I think it's probably down to the size of the sand grains used compared to the size of mouse and other small rodent nails. So whereby it would be effective for thicker nails/ bird claws and talons, there's less friction with smaller mouse nails as they can fit between the sand grains used more. Also I think that bird claws grow more slowly in the first place, so a lesser amount of 'sanding' is needed to see a net loss in length.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

That is funny about the sepia, does indeed sound like you have made one!

I spoiled my hairless and got them lots of nice toys that can help with claws and they have a wheel and multi levels.... they are not in the least bit interested... took one of them ages just to venture up the short trip to the second floor and the other won't even try it. Maybe they are just more delicate so not really used to anything but a bin with nothing but nesting material in it. Oh well my other mice love the things but doesn't help me with their nails much!


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## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

Lilly said:


> SarahC said:
> 
> 
> > Do you ever find their nails an issue? Read some people say you have to clip them, other say you don't bother.


no issues at all with their nails.I've had hairless rats and you do have to cut their nails constantly.Mouse skin always seems smooth and healthy apart from the odd wart.What will you do with the brindles colour wise?I have brindles and think the brindling is best on lighter colours,yellow/red/champagne.I do have the darker ones to since all the brindles in a litter are retained regardless of colour and needless to say I get less of the colours I desire.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

That is good to know about the nails, guess I was worrying a little too much then.

As for the brindles... I am really not sure at the moment, I had read they are better in lighter colours too but my selection is limited. I prefer black eyes personally so don't have any of the large pe selfs and have no reds/yellows. Next show season (over here there may be one more show for the year or it may be over because of the distances involved in travelling) I will likely be trying to get red but for now I am more focused on building up some more.

I managed to get my hands on 3, a black and a chocolate sister from one breeder and a younger black from another, but the two were in with a male (accidentally) while she was breeder hers and did not get pregnant and the younger one is from a doe that took ages to get pregnant and then munched her fist litter. My big worry now is even getting anything from them and I feel it will take a long time.

Since I have blue and chocolate around I was considering seeing what lilac was like, or possibly getting into c-dilutes because I have those too, ch or ce.

Very few people work with them over here so its hard to find any images of the different colours and how they will look. I'd like to just experiment a bit if I can get them going.


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## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

mine were almost at the point of extinction in pursuit of the most attractive colours.Now I breed some just for their fertility and mothering skills in less desirable colours to keep the line safe.I find agouti best for the purpose.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

I would love to see some photos of your different colours if you have any.

I was thinking of breeding with my siamese initially (or one or them anyway) just because they seem to be very fertile and amazing mums, the best i have access to at the moment without going into petshop stock. We'll see how it goes.

Any advice you have with breeding them towards show standards would be amazing too. Although it seems like you can't afford to be picky, but just keep whatever you are lucky enough to get.


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## SarahC (Oct 3, 2008)

having nearly lost mine I'm not to far ahead of you.I started breeding purely to up numbers of fit and fertile ones in January.I branched out into colours I find desirable fairly recently since I can now afford to gamble a bit.Since the most desirable to me are the orange ones, type isn't brill.I'm having to mate the (dominant)reds early because they are already rather fat at just under 8 weeks old.I have some fawns bred from champagnes that have better type.The champagnes have also thrown out a chocolate .I will get some pictures for you.


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## Lilly (Nov 21, 2015)

Red is not that common over here but there are some lines around with few obesity issues. One breeder here has been trying out some sable x-brindle and they look very pretty but as with you for now my sole concern is to get them going and prevent losing the gene that would be a pain to reget (and be quite a while before I could)


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