# Introducing mice to eachother



## Budgiebonkers (Apr 27, 2013)

I read females get along better with eachother then males i have three tanks as i have two feeders a male in one tank and the female in another. The third tank has three new mice two males and i think a female. I would like to put the females with eachother because i dont want unwanted litters if it is indeed a female but I'm out of spare tanks. How do i introduce them. The new one is about maybe 3 weeks old and half the size of the white feeder.


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## TwitchingWhiskers (Feb 2, 2013)

Most of my mice introduce rather easy especially if they have ever been together before. This is what I usually do: clean the cage and the accessories well (hot water and dish soap), set it up like usual, now it shouldn't smell like any of the mice that will go into the cage. Then place all the does in at the same time, and monitor them for a while, using the no blood no foul rule.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

Only had a problem with one doe who was a right cow, all other does introduced with no problem.

Clean the box and stuff.
Put in lots of toilet roll tubes so if something did happen a doe can run and break the line of sight easterly.
Chuck the does in and leave them to it. A bit of chasing and squeaking is no problems as long as there's no actual biting, if one draws blood separate. Normally after a day or two they will be sleeping in the same nest.

But keep in mind if the trio of mice are new if they have anything your existing doe could catch it if not doing any sort of qurientien. Also you may end up needing another box if the two boys start fighting as they get older.
So if I was you I'd buy a forth box put new doe in there for at least a week and if good introduce her to the other doe and then you have a box ready in case the two bucks need separating as if they start to fight by time you go out and get a new box one may get very hurt.


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## silverdawn92 (Jan 13, 2013)

In my experience, just putting them all together in a large tank at the same time confuses them enough that they do not attack each other much. There is no real need to clean anything out unless it is actually dirty. Monitor the males especially, as they will most likely attack each other for dominance. If one of the males is smaller than the other or has smaller... bits... it is more likely to submit early and cease any further violent conflicts. The females will fight for dominance as well, but are generally not as violent. It is alright for them to draw blood once or twice as long as fighting ceases afterward and no more blood is drawn. Mice are unpredictable, however, and I have had one of my males murder another male that he had been staying with for months without warning. They should be carefully monitored for as long as possible. If no blood is drawn, great, they should be alright. If there is a small amount, keep an eye on them. If they are drawing blood like crazy or don't stop fighting after a long time (a half hour or so) without any blood, it is best to separate them again. Note that this is only in my experience with MY mice and these methods are not effective for all mice. Mice are, in my opinion, sentient creatures who are just as volatile as humans, if not even more so, and have unique personalities of their own. Oh, and on another note, you should make sure that the mice you are using as feeders are not too large for your predator animal, as they WILL fight back and can injure your little pet, and we wouldn't want that to happen, would we?


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## TwitchingWhiskers (Feb 2, 2013)

silverdawn92 said:


> In my experience, just putting them all together in a large tank at the same time confuses them enough that they do not attack each other much. There is no real need to clean anything out unless it is actually dirty. Monitor the males especially, as they will most likely attack each other for dominance. If one of the males is smaller than the other or has smaller... bits... it is more likely to submit early and cease any further violent conflicts. The females will fight for dominance as well, but are generally not as violent. It is alright for them to draw blood once or twice as long as fighting ceases afterward and no more blood is drawn. Mice are unpredictable, however, and I have had one of my males murder another male that he had been staying with for months without warning. They should be carefully monitored for as long as possible. If no blood is drawn, great, they should be alright. If there is a small amount, keep an eye on them. If they are drawing blood like crazy or don't stop fighting after a long time (a half hour or so) without any blood, it is best to separate them again. Note that this is only in my experience with MY mice and these methods are not effective for all mice. Mice are, in my opinion, sentient creatures who are just as volatile as humans, if not even more so, and have unique personalities of their own. Oh, and on another note, you should make sure that the mice you are using as feeders are not too large for your predator animal, as they WILL fight back and can injure your little pet, and we wouldn't want that to happen, would we?


I disagree with many of your statements, and do not think it is okay for you to be recommending these practices to newcomers of the hobby, and find it necassary to clear up a few things. I realize your disclaimer at the end about how this may not work with all mice, but you are after all replying to someone else's topic as an answer. First thing I disagree with is letting bucks live together, I know some people have made it work, but usually only litter mates or bucks introduced at a young age. It is very risky and I don't think you shall be recommending this practice if you have had a buck "murder" another. Second thing I disagree with is letting them fight to blood, this is dangerous to the animals, could result in death or serious injury and is going to be painful to the animals involved. Thirdly, it is best to clean out the cages first to prevent one mouse or set of mice from being territorial, it may not always be necessary, but it is a good method of precaution. Last but not least, your statement: "Oh, and another note, you should make sure that the mice you are using for feeders are not too large for predator animal, as they WILL fight back and can injure your little pet, and we wouldn't want that to happen, would we?". Feeding live is not recommended for the reason of harming the predator animal, AND it is an inhumane way for the mouse to die, just thought I would clear that up.

I hope no one takes this into offense, I just want to make sure these things are clear to the OP.


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## silverdawn92 (Jan 13, 2013)

TwitchingWhiskers said:


> silverdawn92 said:
> 
> 
> > In my experience, just putting them all together in a large tank at the same time confuses them enough that they do not attack each other much. There is no real need to clean anything out unless it is actually dirty. Monitor the males especially, as they will most likely attack each other for dominance. If one of the males is smaller than the other or has smaller... bits... it is more likely to submit early and cease any further violent conflicts. The females will fight for dominance as well, but are generally not as violent. It is alright for them to draw blood once or twice as long as fighting ceases afterward and no more blood is drawn. Mice are unpredictable, however, and I have had one of my males murder another male that he had been staying with for months without warning. They should be carefully monitored for as long as possible. If no blood is drawn, great, they should be alright. If there is a small amount, keep an eye on them. If they are drawing blood like crazy or don't stop fighting after a long time (a half hour or so) without any blood, it is best to separate them again. Note that this is only in my experience with MY mice and these methods are not effective for all mice. Mice are, in my opinion, sentient creatures who are just as volatile as humans, if not even more so, and have unique personalities of their own. Oh, and on another note, you should make sure that the mice you are using as feeders are not too large for your predator animal, as they WILL fight back and can injure your little pet, and we wouldn't want that to happen, would we?
> ...


I believe that it is perfectly alright for mice to be used as feeders for a predator animal. They must eat as well, it is not their fault that they were born that way. It may be a terrible way for a mouse to die, but that is not really relevant when you have a pet such as a snake that requires live feeding. Also, I simply replied with MY methods, as I stated in the disclaimer, and I realize that they do not work for everyone. My friend tried and her males all went ballistic. I believe that a small amount of blood is fine. I have had mice draw blood once, never do it again, and get along perfectly afterward. I only allow this to go on because I have ways to prevent infection in small wounds and it is not practical to buy more tanks because one mouse gets bit to the point of bleeding one time. I never clean the cages out when introducing mice. It stresses out the mice in the tank and they fight even more because they don't smell their own scents in a place that they recognize. I have perfectly valid reasons to introduce my mice the way that I do. Simply stating the way that I do things does not mean that I am recommending it to anyone else per se, I am stating that it is one method that you may try, though it may be more risky to try with mice that have not been accustomed to living in large groups. I introduce them this way because they have always been raised in huge tanks with up to twenty other mice and are used to newcomers and large groups. If you want more information as to why I use my methods, you may ask me now.


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## PPVallhunds (Jul 26, 2010)

No one's saying predators don't need to eat mice but that they don't need to eat live mice, 99% of captive animals will either eat thawed mice or can be slowly accustomed to eating thawed, and that include snakes. Due to this in the UK live feeding of vertebrates is only allowed as a last resort but the rspca have said they will prosecute any live feeding cases they hear of.


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## Budgiebonkers (Apr 27, 2013)

Just to clarify my feeders are not for reptiles as i dont even own a reptile lol as for fighting ill retry when i clean them to see if it helps. 
I have other cages like critter trails but i think they could sqeeze through the bars.


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## silverdawn92 (Jan 13, 2013)

I use critter trail cages for a few of my groups and they do fine... It all depends on the size of the bars. If you could measure them or tell me the exact sort of cage you have I can tell you if they can squeeze out or not... That statistic would appear to be false here, as most of the snake owners I know have to buy their feeders live because they simply will not eat anything else no matter if they heat them or just thaw them enough to be eaten. As for the UK, I do not live there, so I do not know of the animal/feeder laws there.


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## TwitchingWhiskers (Feb 2, 2013)

Budgiebonkers said:


> Just to clarify my feeders are not for reptiles as i dont even own a reptile lol as for fighting ill retry when i clean them to see if it helps.
> I have other cages like critter trails but i think they could sqeeze through the bars.


I have heard that if a pen can fit through, most mice will be able to squeeze through. I'm not completely sure though, as I don't really use bar cages. It may also depend on the size of the mouse, as mice can vary from 20 gram feeders to quite large show mice, lol.


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## angelofwhimsy (Dec 11, 2011)

I have to admit, I'm super paranoid so as well as cleaning the boxes I also swap several groups into new boxes so if any scents linger it's not those of the mice being introduced to so none of them feel defensive of 'their' home and this has worked better for me than introing into a large tank. I had 4 living together and no matter what I did they would -not- accept a new pair and drew blood and had some awful scuffles that were clearly distressing for everyone. And to be honest it distressed me! But since I've been able to put several does together, move groups, put new mice into established groups with very little problem, if the mice are shy and tend to hide then I've found those tend to "fit in" better whereas confident mice tend to want to be in charge and those tend to take a little more time to settle together while they agree on the boundaries :lol:

Best of luck! Scary as it feels (and maybe sounds) girls do tend to settle together pretty readily and happily and they'll appreciate having a live-in friend so much more than living alone!


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