# I'm getting some brindles!



## violet1991

a real good friend of mine (Jan Alston) has very kindly let me have a couple of brindle does to breed. I gave her the buck she used, and he produced her 6 brindles in 3 litters! Which is a high percentage! Anyway, I am thrilled, I will be getting these on the 14th June hopefully at a cavy show I'm going to judge pets and Juvs at. I really can't wait. Pics taken by Jan...

#1









#2









A very happy Vi xxx


----------



## dangermouse

they are so stunning ...... im very pleased for you.....


----------



## julieszoo

Very attractive markings - good luck breeding more


----------



## NaomiR

they're really beautiful Vi they look like my favourite cavy colour - strawberry roan


----------



## Rissy

gosh they are delicious.


----------



## Maplewood Stud

wow theyre really pretty, how the hell do u get brindles though? x


----------



## SarahC

you have to introduce the gene,you can't make it.Only brindle does can be reared all brindle bucks die at around 10 days,best to cull immediately so that they don't suffer.Any non brindle bucks and does in the litter won't be carrying the brindle gene so are also useless for creating more.Therefore you are always on a knife edge with them.You get litters with only brindle bucks or no brindles at all.It is quite exciting waiting to see what you get,good luck with them.


----------



## Maplewood Stud

so how come all the brindle bucks die - i dont understand that bit? x


----------



## sommy

me too....


----------



## Cait

It's genetic that the bucks die, there is no way to save them. Occasionally one may survive but they are weak and infertile. On a related note, the reason for the brindle pattern is to do with malabsorption of copper. I have often wondered whether feeding more copper would have any effect on the pattern but I don't have enough does to experiment with really.


----------



## julieszoo

That's really interesting, so do the brindle does always survive, or can they have problems too?


----------



## Cait

Brindle does have the same survival rate as any other mouse - they don't suffer any ill effects due to being a brindle.


----------



## sommy

The brindle bucks that may survive, are they always infertile?


----------



## Cait

Yes, they are. And 99% die anyway.


----------



## sommy

sarahC said if you get non-brindles in a litter they don't carry the brindle gene, would those bucks die?


----------



## julieszoo

http://www.hiiret.fi/eng/breeding/varie ... indle.html

Having just read this article, I wish anyone breeding these the very best of luck!


----------



## Cait

The non brindle bucks are just normal mice as they don't have the brindle gene. However if you're breeding for brindles clearly you don't need to keep any bucks at all so personally I cull all bucks as soon as possible. I believe sarahc does the same but of course she would have to confirm. They are a difficult variety to breed as of course you can quite easily end up with no brindles in a litter. Statistically 25% of a litter should be brindle females, but in my experience it's usually 1 or if you're lucky 2 per litter, regardless of litter size. I've also had a few with no brindles at all, which is really disappointing.


----------



## sommy

On the link it says when holding from the tail the legs clasp inwards, why is that?


----------



## julieszoo

Mousebreeder, do you see any of the neurological problems that article mentions? I appreciate that site is not a UK one, which is why I ask if the problems have been bred out here.


----------



## julieszoo

With such low numbers produced it must be a challenge to even maintain the gene.


----------



## Cait

None of my does have any problems, they are normal mice just with a brindle pattern. I think maybe the article was referring to the brindle bucks when it mentioned the shaking etc? The does certainly don't do that whether they're brindle or self, nor do they clasp their legs together rather than splay them out like other mice.


----------



## violet1991

I'm looking forward to them, and I am no stranger to hard varieties and 'lethal' genes. I am always up for increasing numbers!

Vi x


----------



## Maplewood Stud

good for u honey - good luck with them  x


----------



## SarahC

the brindle does and all the non brindles in the litters are perfectly normal and healthy nothing at all to cause a problem.It is only the brindle bucks that are non viable.From personal experience I consider it to be cruel to try and grow the bucks on.Sometimes,understandebly we have to find these things out for ourselves to be convinced.All the brindle bucks are a shiny white regardless of the parents colour.I don't know the reasons.Perhaps mousebreeder knows?I have removed two today,white with black eyes from a litter of red x red brindle.Of the remaining litter there are two agouti brindles one red brindle and one fawn brindle,happy days


----------



## dangermouse

congrats on your brindles Sarah.....


----------



## violet1991

in breeding dal X dal cavies the double up of the dal gene, much like a the male brindles has the same effect. In cavies the babies with deformaties are call anothalmic or microthalmic whites (or something with similar names, tis hard to spell!). theyre born with pink eyes, if they have any at all, and are white. deformaties include no teeth, no organs ect, most die without having to cull (and this type of thing being born is the only reason a cavy breeder would cull, as cavies are born fully developed)
this is avoided in cavies by using selfs though. However i know you cant get over it that easy in mice since its sex linked, but maybe one day a buck will be born without this lethal outcome? never know when mutations will appear in the genes. but untill then, what has to be done, has to be done!!

vi x


----------



## april

omg I have never seen such beautiful brindles! I didn't think they could have markings like that!


----------



## Cait

UK brindles are a different gene to US brindles and are sex-linked


----------



## april

Oh wow. Well I want to go over there and take some back xD


----------



## violet1991

well I have them noooow! and they are sooooo stunning. Jan was very generous and actually gave me 3 rather than 2! One has gone in with my argente buck, Cameo, and she's looking round now after 2 weeks so looks like I'll have my first brindle litter in a week or so. The other two will go in with him soon too. I idealy didn't want them all to go in with the same buck, but I don't have any other suitable! Cameo will do for now though, I'll try get hold of some more bucks at London champs maybe 

pic of the 3rd doe...









Vi x


----------



## zoocrewmice

Wow, they are all gorgeous!  If you all weren't so far away I'd come snatch a few up. :lol:


----------



## Velvet_Meece

What fabulous mice, they're all stunning, good luck with breeding them!


----------

